A Good Case For Poor Genetics

Welby

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Check out the buck below.  I edited two photos of the same buck taken in the same setting so that he appears as two bucks and so that you can see him from two different angles.

If there has ever been a case for genetic culling, this is it...this buck is the second nearly identical three point buck I have gotten on film in this area (the other one has long since shed his velvet) in the past two months.  In addition, for the past several years, there has been so many more three points than any other size buck in this area.  And all have had a fork on the left side, a single spike on the right side.  What do you think?

 

jayber

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I agree.....get rid of 'em!  I see quite a few second year 'scrubs' around too.  Last year I saw one during bow season with one horn that curled around in front of his face.  I should have got rid of him then, but I thought that maybe he was injured somehow.  Well, I got him on film earlier this year so I know that was not the case.  He's going down the next chance I get at him!  I have to wonder though, with all the deer around and as much as they breed, can we ever break even or get ahead?!
 

Welby

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I must say that here in Mississippi, a legal buck MUST have at least four points.  However, I am nearly convinced that these deer have found a way to grow no more than three points to take advantage of these hunting regulations and therefore secure their survival from year to year.  There could be no other explanation.

Should I break the rules??
 

gtk

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That's the very reason Larry Castle and other's are lobbying the "powers" to allow private landowners and hunting clubs to harvest smaller bucks.  The "four-point" rule is supposed to be a "temporary fix", Larry said.

Wait till it's legal.
 

Tinhorn

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hi guys,

Check out this little guy trying to act like a biggun' by twisting his spikes forward, he can't fool me, I'm too ignorant!

Trouble with culling is wasting a tag, is it worth it? is the big question for me, at least, if your not after just meat......

See Ya!

Tinhorn

 

jayber

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That's exactly the struggle Tinhorn, using up a tag on these type of deer.  On the otherhand, if nobody shoots them then pretty soon what quality will there be in the bloodlines?  I'm fortunate enough to have a few nuisance permits for both archery and gun seasons for my dad's farm.  That is why I have taken the stance on shooting a few more does and 'scrub' bucks.
 

gtk

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Tags ?.. Tags ??  We don't need no stink'n tags down here in MS... :spin-yellow:

They just trust us to call in on a 1-800 number X # of hours after the kill...
 

jayber

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Illinois did that one year that I recall.....wonder why they stopped?  Maybe they figured they weren't getting accurate numbers / untrusting souls (?).
 

bigmandude

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my reply dissappeared so i'll try again.

i feel your pain welby, we have a bloodline at my camp that produces bucks with no brow tine on the left side.  we culled 3 of em last year, 2 5pts and 1 7 pt.  

we also took 3 3-pts....  i know what the law says and i get no thrill from shooting 3 pts .. we let the kids do the shootin.  with the excitement the kids get out of it we figure it is worth the $100 fine if we get caught.  

no game official knows better than you what is best for your area.

the law last year had what 7 does and 3 bucks per hunter,,,,???  a 2 to 1 ratio would damage our area, we shot equal numbers of each.  we dont have too many does at our place.  

pick up a copy of the Deer Data Book from MDWFP for free and compare kills per acre, ages taken, average anter size and points by age, average weight, and diseases found, for each county in our state.  
 

wapiti

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I disagree Welby.  Those are yearling bucks and because their skeletons are still growing not much will go into antler development.  Harvesting more does will help more than anything.  They will run their buck fawns out of the area. I know of several 3 pointers that have made some awesome 10 pointers after 4 years.

Never judge a buck by his first set of headgear, except that a yearling 10 pointer has tremendous potential.
 

Welby

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Thanks for all the replies, guys!

Wapiti, despite what I have said above, I agree with you for the most part.  Fact is, this deer is a young deer and in two or three more years may make a fine trophy.  Next year, he may even be a fine trophy.

However, there is a disturbing trend of more and more fully mature and well developed bucks that still only possess marginal headgear.  Make no mistake about it, there are some monsters that are taken in this area, but most mature bucks are still very under developed antlerwise.  There are a lot of mature bucks running around here with only three or four points to show off.  And there are eight points with barely an 8" spread.

Genetics has some role in this, I am sure, but there are other factors as well.  I know that without proper nutrition and minerals these deer will never develop headgear worthy of their full potential.
 

bigmandude

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ok, i looked it up and the 3 pt falls within the averages for your area.  it still sounds small for a 1.5 year old to me ...but as we mentioned in another page our breeding seasons get quite squirrely down here sometimes going on throughout half the year or more  which could explain alot.  the studies put deer into categories such as 0.5 years, 1.5 years, 2.5 years and so on .. this lumps deer born 3months late into a category with the others.. giving them less time to develop.    

just my theory,  by the way the Deer Data Book is now online at MDWFP.com
 

gtk

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Welby.. Where are u from in MS ?  Bigmandude.. Are you from MS too ?  If so, where.. I'm from Olive Branch, just south of Memphis.

I hope they change the 4-point rule sometime in the future (not that I want to kill a buch of four points).   I take some people hunting with me sometimes, and i would rather them take a small buck (spike/4 point) anyday, rather than take a 2 1/2 year old 6 or 8.

I hope enough hunters care enough to use the phone-tag system, and it will benefit Larry and Co...
 

bigmandude

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yep GTK , im a MS boy too.

i live in brandon, near the Ross Barnett Reservoir.

i think blackwater is a local boy too, not sure
 

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