spectr17

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ATVs Wreak Havoc in Forest Lands

1/12/03

By Skip Knowles, The Salt Lake Tribune

When the hunting question pops up and people ask how I can kill animals, and I tell them it is because it still is illegal to shoot all-terrain vehicles.

ATV enthusiasts had better get their act together, fast, because responsible users of the outdoors are eager to do it for them.

Yes, most riders stay on-trail. But someone is wreaking havoc in national forests and scarring the Wasatch Front with illegal trails stretching down like varicose veins from the hills, and it is not elves.

There is nothing like hiking two hours into a remote area to be there when the sun rises only to have some slob with a jelly doughnut in one hand throttle up and shout "Howdy!" loud enough to be heard over his engine.

But most of the time, they do not even see you.

State big game manager Steve Cranney is not up for Presidential Fitness awards, but as an ethical black-powder hunter, he enjoys getting well off the trail and into the timber.

He feels like ATVs are getting way out of hand. Far from a legal road, he has seen guys on ATVs cruising through timber, passing right by him, oblivious. One such "hunter" even claimed to be stalking game he had spotted!

"What kind of hunting experience is that?" Cranney asks.

ATVs are ugly, noisy, polluting, erosion-boosters that are antithetical to all that is natural. They keep people out of touch with nature and out of physical shape.

Sadly, deer that would flee from a natural predator often stand and stare at these alien machines and are shot. This validates the use of machines to these "hunters."

It hardly is all hunters who trash the hills; weekend joy-riders also tear up the Wasatch Front. ATVs finally degraded the Bountiful foothills to the point reclamation efforts pushed them from 90 percent of the area. I have seen up to eight illegal trails in 100 yards on the Farmington Loop, and was tailed by an ATV as I hiked down the mountain with a friend last weekend. Illegal and off-trail, of course.

I had used my feet, and it didn't even hurt.

It is not the machines. I love riding them; I hate their illegal use. ATVs are dangerous but exhilarating.

They do not, however, belong in the forest. Vast parks exist in the desert on BLM land where people can kill themselves if they want to.

We lost one of the best diversity-advocate politicians this state has seen, badly needed Democratic state senator Pete Suazo, to a four-wheeler while bowhunting two years ago. ATVs kill and paralyze an awful lot of people -- every rider knows a now-dead one -- but personal safety is another issue.

Getting them kicked off the public land is not, but is proving surprisingly easy in a state in which it seems every middle-class garage has an ATV. They are doing it themselves. An old Nevada cowboy I met in Salina calls them "wilderness makers."

"Every time I see one of them being used illegally," he told me, "I know that area is one step closer to being closed off to everyone."

Each year, ugly new lacerations appear across the deep grass meadows of the high Uintas, and miscreants ride illegally up to a mile off-road on the edge of Skyline drive, too lazy to walk to the edge of the stunning bowls.

Last year, two drove right through our deer camp, well off road, sparking a confrontation. My 60-year-old mother, the sweetest woman you ever will meet, once lost her cool and confronted ATV idiots driving through timber while she deer-hunted -- "are you guys animal rights activists or what?"

They should be banned completely from at least half the state's forests. Regular truck access is plenty for hunting purposes, way too good for mule deer and elk populations, actually.

Handicapped hunters do well hunting from vehicles. I know, my brother is a 26-year-old with cerebral palsy. Many times we have ridden the backroads, chasing grouse. If we got a handle on illegal road-hunters, the pickings would be much better for legal handicapped road hunters.

Besides, nobody wants to ban handicapped people from hunting with ATVs.
Just the doughnut-munching slobs.
 

Constitutionalist

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This is why I hunt exclusively in New Mexico Wilderness Areas. I made a mistake last year and tried an "everyone" section, and it turned out poorly.

When you have to hump three miles to reach Elk ground (not to mention the additional five to eight you are going to cover later), you don't run into anyone who is not fully committed to the task of hunting. Yes, a few on horseback now and then, but nothing to break up the Rocky Mountain Experience.

Now, I am not on a high-horse dogging ATVs (they have their place), I am just stating ATVs do not have a place anywhere in my hunting experience.

When I get older and can't hump the elevations, I'll buy a horse
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hunthog

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Yes, they should be banned. It's a good thing they're so hard to hit with an arrow or I'd really be in trouble.

hunthog
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buck59

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They have taken advantage of a good mode of trasportaion aand turned it against them selves by having some jerks with no respect for the regulations. IT`S a becoming a zoo and has made some of these jerks lazy hunters and trashing there own riths to use public land.
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easymoney

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I feel that ATV's are like any other tool( gun, skilsaw, wrench, etc) they are only a tool, if used properly. I also believe these vehicles need to be regulated. Just the same as personal watercraft(jet skis).
A few bad apples have definitely ruined it for anyone who uses their ATV's with responsibility. Here in California, a drive down any major highway or freeway will give you a view of the endless "trails" cut across both public and private property by the machine riders, without any respect for that personal or public property. These are not people getting from point A to point B. These are people trying to purposely damage the terrain and make as much noise as possible. Burning out, getting scratch, jumping things may be fun and do no damage in a designated ATV park. But it frosts me to no end, to hump my A%$ on foot for miles into the wilderness to hunt, only to have some SOB blow by on a scooter honking and spraying me with dirt. They have no place in the woods. Let those who wish to ride their machines pay a fee, go to a scooter park and rip it up with all the other machine riders.
 

MrRee

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You guys are right!!!
what can I add. I have seen a very pristine sand dune at the end of my property distroyed by 2 of them. It will take years if it ever comes back to the beauty it once had.

They have there place, and that is on private property, not out ruining the beauty of the forests for everyone. I can see slowly driveing one out to a remote area with your gear, or hauling stuff to plant food plots, but when you do, you are not tearing up the ground like the idiots who race them all over the woods & trails.
 

Rooter

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I have also seen destruction by guys riding their bikes like madmen. The only problem I have is that like idiots that shoot roadsigns, over roads, and generally gun owners that don't follow the rules that small group is ruining it for everyone. I am not going to debate the value of the bikes because not everyone is physically capable of hiking into the back country and not everyone can keep a horse. There are laws in place to handle the people that break gun laws like there are laws to handle the people that can't responsibly ride their quads. Lets enforce the laws we have rather than ban them. We are sounding like the anti's when we say that. Just my opinion.

Rooter
 

FTTPOW

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I'm torn on this one. There's a time and place for everything and a right and wrong way of doing it. I also disagree with someone who's tearing up the place in the name of fun, but the public forests aren't just for hunters either. There's enough room for all of us, if we learn how to keep from disrupting others. I've ridden sanctioned events on State Forests and National Forests and feel like I have every right to do so. I've also hunted on these areas as well. Some events will start later in the day so as not to disturb hunters in the mornings. I know of one event that moved the date so that it wouldn't coincide with the hunting season. In the Wayne National Forest in Ohio, there are designated trails that can legally be ridden during hunting seasons (April 15-December 15). Hunters use these trails to get back in and to haul game out. If you set up near a trail, don't be surprised if someone else rides by while you're hunting.
As for private land, if you don't have permission to be there it doesn't matter if you're hunting or riding, you're trespassing. I also understand and agree that some public areas are too fragile to be ridden on if you're not careful to tread lightly. Too many of the general public don't understand how to have low impact on the land. That's why some areas are closed off. If a road is gated to keep vehicles from disturbing wildlife, stay out.
I'm assuming where you're seeing vehicles that are causing you problems is in one of those areas. If it's open public land, it's just that. Open. I believe that if ATV's stay on the trails and don't go charging through the brush making their own, they have as much right to be there as hunters, hikers and horses. I've seen some bridle trails that have as much or more damage done by horses as could have been done by off-road bikes. I've also seen some damage from bikes and ATV's that have torn up the area greatly.
I know I don't have the right to ride wherever I want to. That's not what I'm trying to say. I do feel like I have the right to ride in a lot more places than I currently have. I like to ride almost as much as I like to hunt. WE ALL OWN THE PUBLIC LAND. We just have to have cooperation on when and how we use it and avoid conflicting with different groups using it at the same time. I don't want my hunt molested by an ATV being where they shouldn't be any more than I want to be harrassed by someone when I'm riding where I should.
 

PoorAim

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I think many of you anti-atv folks may want to reconsider what you are saying.
Here are some quotes I picked out from this thread:

"They have there place, and that is on private property"

"Yes, they should be banned"

"ATVs are ugly, noisy, polluting, erosion-boosters that are antithetical to all that is natural"

These comments all sound EXACTLY like the Anti-Hunting rhetoric we hear.

Riding an ATV on public land is a LEGAL endeavor that millions of Americans enjoy every year. Just like Hunting, there are many people out there who would like have it banned simply because it is not compatible with THEIR beliefs.

With that said, I do not condone in ANY way the abuse of lands or irresponsible behavior with ATVs. Again, as with hunting you have a few idiots spoiling it for the masses. I agree that many times there are conflicts between ATVs and other public land users, but this doesn’t mean that all ATVs should be banned from public land.

I have been riding motorbikes and hunting since I was big enough to do so, and consider both to be family traditions. On both fronts I see attacks and closures all the time, most of the time these efforts are being pushed through by people who have no ability to understand others points of view. I would ask you to consider other people’s perspectives and hobbies before demanding a ban on something.

Please consider this, as a legal rider and hunter it is MUCH more difficult for me to find legal areas to ride on public land than it is for me to find legal areas to hunt, and I see more riding area closures all the time, versus relatively few hunting closures. How would you feel if a public area that you have been hunting your entire life was suddenly closed to hunting because of “public opinion”?
Again I realize that there are too many abusers on ATVs and motorcycles out there, and more intelligent and fair rules probably are needed, especially in certain areas. Just keep in mind how you feel when someone who is an anti-hunter starts hunter-bashing and talking about “banning hunting”.

Some ideas I have that may be feasible would be things like; required ATV drivers licenses, ATV closures in certain areas during key hunting times, more strict noise requirements. These things shouldn’t have to be required if ATV users would just be smart about what they are doing, but in my mind, solutions like these are way better than the continued trend of “no-use” areas.

If ATVs are banned, will all forest roads to trucks be next?? Will you be dragging your next Elk 12 miles to the nearest road on all public land? From what I have seen Hunters are heavy users of ATVs in the first place, and as users of public land I think both hunters and ATVers should stick together as their are many others out there who would like to ban all of us from public land if possible.

I think as individuals we just should be good stewards of our sports. As hunters we should teach young people the proper ways of the sport, and self-police the abusers (call the warden, not be vigilantes) and ATV riders should do the same.

The box is all yours…
 

tmoniz

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I made the mistake of scouting for deer last year in D14 near coxey meadows and just east of the shooting range north of Arrowhead near an atv staging area. I had never been there before. Boy what a pain in the butt that was. I was dodging those atv guys all day long. It was a Saturday. Next time out I made it a point to go back on a weekday. There is a place for them. Where exactly that is I do not know.
 

coyote170

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Some of us are thankful for the permits
to ride as with out it we could not enjoy
the woods,hunting,etc.!
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Big Al

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Pooraim Excelent post my feelings are the same. Having just purchased my first ATV I had visions of riding for miles on my quad with a small tent ,bag and a few others. The reality is going to an off road park and having the dirt bikers throw rocks at me. There has got to be an answer.But I fear its just going to be more unenforceable gov. interferance/laws. By the way, why do orv park rangers need to carry riot shot guns and 9mm? Al
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wmidbrook

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There's no question that those who ignore the rules, can & do tear up habitat. Also, there's no question that they've disturbed many, many hunts in areas that were formerly accessible only by horses or on foot.

In several areas of Idaho, Wyo, & Utah that I've hunted in, if you didn't have a quad or horse you were at a severe disadvantage. There were many, many trails where only a quad or a horse would go--not even a jeep or hummer would punch thru.

I don't have one yet, but they are definately a full on advantage for scouting new country a lot faster than a jeep or truck, getting to distant 'spike camps' for embarking on foot, etc. I hear that there are even 'double-muffler' systems for getting those things super quiet now.

In Utah, I had to hike an hour just to span the gap from where I could get my 4x4 Nissan, to the place where you could only go further on foot. That would give an atv'er a serious advantage in my book.

I think ATVs are here to stay. The clubs are growing rapidly and are well organized and will have big lobbying $$$. Also, 9 out of 10 ranchers will also back the use of ATVs on public grounds.

You really have to plan your hunt around where they can/can't go to give your hunt better odds of success especially if you don't have one.
 

Arizona Griz

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There are some very good posts here. It all goes back to responsibility. I use quads in hunting, but just to keep from ruining my truck, and never going off road ( which is against the law in Arizona except to retrieve downed game). It just takes a few bad apples to ruin it for the rest of us.
Arizona Griz.
 

widgnwhacker

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I have witnessed many ATV riders in areas that they should not be
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I personally think that they should be allowed for handicapped hunters and for elder hunters. I archery hunt elk in Arizona when lucky enough to draw a tag. I have had many chances at nice animals blown due to irresponsible ATV riders. If you are gonna ride them, then ride them to the area you want to hunt and them park it and hump into your hunting area. You might be surprised at what you see and you just might not piss off everyone else in the forest.

WW
 
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