Is this the end of hunting?

KID CREOLE

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A guy I know and his father are avid upland hunters, probably as hardcore upland guys as they come.  We got into to a heated discussion about the pay to hunt issue, this guy and his dad are hunting the property of Abadetti Farms in El Centro.  

The cost to hunt this property is $200.00 per day, the limit is 2 pheasants per day all season long which is weekend only, he does provide Bismuth Shot for each of his clients to use as they don't allow lead shot for pheasant hunting.

Now I have a couple issues here, I fear that more and more of these farmers will start charging higher and higher fees to access property that contains public game.  If $200.00 is OK why not make it $500.00 or more.

The pheasants that are in the Imperial Valley were planted there by our DFG and our license money in the 60's and 70's and here today we hunters are being denied access to these birds.  What next, a $50.00 toll to drive dirt roads around Niland for dove season.

Who knows the answer, is our DFG doing enough to improve hunting?

I have the money to pay for the pass on this property but it will be a cold day in **** before I do.  I worry that as more and more farmers charge to hunt their land more and more hunters won't hunt, I feel that the more hunters we lose the easier it will be to stop or ban hunting in California.

I must share a story about a car I passed coming back from Arizona last month.  A gentlemen driving a small Saturn with his camo canoe strapped on top, the car stuffed with duck hunting gear and his son riding shotgun next to him were on their way home from the duck opener.  The reason this caught my was that this guy who appeared to be on a budget that may not have had a truck to use stuffed everything they needed into this small car to go hunting.  Who knows, maybe his regular hunt vehicle was broken down and he rented this Saturn.  


The most important aspect of hunting right here and right now as far as I'm concerned is not if I shoot a limt of ducks or make that clean shot on a rooster, but that my five year old son have the opportunity to hunt if he chooses to do so and his right to choose is slowly being elimenated.


Please excuse any typos!
 



Megadeth

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Your absolutley right. Its called the softening of America. If they cant deny us our right to hunt, they'll make you pay out your nose anyways. I think the DFG is spending way way way too much money on extra expenditures instead of buying new lands. The Govt agency (CA DFG) is making a one day hunt quite expensive. Its a load of #$%^&&**!!!!!!!
 

Pasco

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I don't pay private parties to hunt, yet.  This gets a little complicated for me.  I have to drive 50+ miles to find a 'good' place to hunt these days.  Twenty to thirty years ago that distance was much less(of course I was too young to care then).  All the agricultural land was converted to housing, now there is no hunting at all.  At least these farmers are finding creative ways to keep their land viable for themselves, and those willing to pay to hunt (and lining their pockets with money).  I bet they could get top dollar for their lands from golf course developers.  I'm a believer in supply and demand, it does sicken me a bit, but if the market is there, I can't fault them for profitting from it.  

Not to be too gloom and doom, but if the gov't buys up land for us to hunt on the anti's will eventually erode our hunting on those lands with firearms ordinances and protections of endangered fleas, etc (witness Mojave Preserve).

Please someone put a different spin on this so that I can get out of this depression.
 

duckman2000

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did you say $200 a day.if so if anybody pay's that the are stupid.you can go to quail point and pay $65 for three birds and get all you can harvest for no extra cost. a wild bird is not worth $100 each to me
 

foulshot

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Kid, I too was amazed at the amount and cost to hunt for publicly funded birds.  But then I'm more amazed at the amount of idiots I see hunting wet fields, leaving their trash all over the place, and a general inconsideration for the people who have to work the land when we leave the valley.  I had the chance to meet Abotti jr. at first dove opener and he seemed like a nice enough guy.  I did not hunt on his property though.  I too am not willing to pay $200 for the hunt.  It seems to me someone mentioned something about the farmers having to have a business liscense to charge for hunting, is this true?
As far as the DFG buying land, I know they purchased some land in San Diego but I'm not sure what they have planned for it.  They had a dove hunt on first opener and they have the pheasant hunts through gamebird heritage.  Some of the land would make excellent quail, pheasant and dove hunting if taken care of properly.  The DFG is allowing Desert Wildlife Unlimited to tend to some property down in the valley with DFG money, but to what extent I'm not sure.
I feel your pain!!!!  
Has anyone called their local elected officials?
 

Thonzberry

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I,ve been hunting with my dad since I was 5 yrs. old, I'm 35 now and I have hunted on a club 3 times for Pheasent. I have never paid to hunt quail nor will I ever, there is a lot of public land out there to hunt, you just have to look hard for it.
What the clubs a charging to hunt is a @#$% joke.
Hunting is becoming a rich mans game let a lone the fact that the places I used to hunt as a kid are full of homes. What gets me all pissed off is the fact that my boys will not get to see those place, and maybe to hunt in California.
I might just move to another state if Cal. turns into an anti hunting state. I pray that it will never happen.
As far the farmers turning there land into hunt clubs and charging an arm and a leg is there right to do so, it's sad but true.
Hopefully the DFG will do something about this issue.
 

D Sea

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Kid,

You are absolutely right.  Although the farmers have every right to charge a fee for hunters to access their land, I will never do it to hunt upland game.  This past dove season, I got the chance to talk to Leon Lessica of Desert Wilerness Unlimited.  He expessed similar concerns.  He and others from his group recognize the economic value of upland game hunting to the Imperial Valley.  He said he hoped to work with gamebird breaders in Riverside and Imperial County next year to maybe release some birds back into the valley on the land that he acquired for public use.  Leon is a really good guy and judging by the popularity of the fields he planted this year, maybe all hope isn't lost.  Hopefully, the DFG can increase his share of the Upland Game Bird Stamp money so he can expand even more in the years of come.  

I've got a 2 year old boy who I want to have experience the things I did while hunting the Imperial Valley, and I sure as heck am not going to pay $200 a day to have him do it.

DC
 

KID CREOLE

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DC,

I've hunted with Leon a few times and as important as the fields he worked with around Niland it's just the tip of the iceberg.  Leon and the rest of the folks from Desert Wildlife Unlimited have been building guzzlers on their own in the Chocolates, they acquired fiberglass fuel tanks that are cleaned and prepped and are buried in the ground with a ramp installed to allow birds and desert mule deer to walk down and drink.  Leon has been flown all over the world to help build guzzlers.

I don't have any problem with farmers charging to hunt on their land but when almost all pheasant hunting happens on private property why have a season at all.  Calif DFG needs to do more to provide more opportunity for of us without paying $200.00 to hunt chickens.
 

birdogman

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What does the California DFG do at all for hunters besides making our life more difficult? As well as the state of California in general. I've got a 12 year old who is really into hunting this year for the first time. I've got 2 other kids and things are tight. I can't afford expensive pay to hunt fees, and most of the public land is either posted or has no birds. And the birds we do have are shipped to Nevada when they already have enough birds. And why isn't China Lake open anymore. If it isn't a fire closure, it's a military base, if it's not a military base it's private land or a club! What is wrong with this state? Oh yeah, one more thing and then I'll shut up, the land you can hunt you have to buy an  Adventure Pass for!!! I refuse to purchase one!
 

Fubar

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There used to be 20 to 30 of us that hunted El Centro for pheasants. NO more. The losers are the people of El Centro. We spent a lot of money at Motels stores etc. The place was full of hunters. Now, because of some greedy farmers, we will hunt elsewhere. If they want to make the fees reasonable, we may go back. Otherwise they can have it.                    Fubar
 

ranchwife

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My question is to all of you who stated that DF&G should be purchasing more land:  Do you really think it is wise for the DF&G to use tax dollars to purchase more land when they can't even effectively manage the land they already have?  Or the wildlife?  If DF&G would start effectively managing their current lands and wildlife, then maybe they purchasing more land would be justifiable.
 

tinner

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nothing personal but i really hate it when the woman in the group is right  

(Edited by tinner at 3:18 pm on Nov. 9, 2001)
 

hronk

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Ranch wife.  How are you managing wildlife on your place better than DFG is.  Remember, They let people on the public land where you can just post some signs and keep people out.  That doesn't prove to me that Ranchers do a better job than public entities.  They try (and not always successful) to manage where everyone can utilize(sp) the available game.  Private land owners manage for themselves and a select few.......hronk
 

Chris

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We need more hunting advocates inside the system...from inside the DFG itself to the top man in the state.  Sure would be nice to see an outdoorsman run against Gray Davis.  

We also need to continue to improve our image in the eyes of landowners.  Nothing closes up a field quicker than a landowner's bad experience with some yahoo calling himself a hunter.  We've got to do a better job of earning and securing the trust of the landowners.  Hell, I've even seen DFG fields in the Imperial Valley that were an absolute mess after the dove opener.  I've seen blind sites at Wister so full of trash that I couldn't pack it all out.  There's just no excuse for this behavior.  I'm teaching my boys to be hunters and outdoorsmen, to have respect for the land, the water we fish, the game we havest, the code of ethics of a good hunter, etc...I'm sure most of you are doing, or have done the same.  
 

Slugblaster

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DFG JUnior & Family Pheasant hunt are a good example of The DFG doing something positive. They hook up with Quail Unlimited and put on a good program. Scott Sewell heads up the program and thats who you should contact with your concerns. As far as a sportsmen for Governor, Hronk would get my vote.
 

Triggerfinger

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Marsh Brother (aka KID):  Some people will never have the common sense to figure out what you're talking about (the guy and his father); however, you sure seem to have a sharp bunch of tacks over here on this chat board!

later.
 

grizz

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You've had it pretty good down there if you could just go out in most any field and hunt.  Those days were pretty much gone since the early 70's. up here in the sac. valley.  Pheasant hunting is a pay to play now days unless you know someone who has land.
I am kinda over it now(not really) but it sure would piss me off when each year I would lose anther spot to a club.  It's all about $$$$$$$
 

Richard

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My 2 cents.  Well I am with all you folks.  I have not and will  not pay  anyone $200 to shot birds (maybe a fund raiser).  Just because they can charge this fee, just another way to rip people off.   I heard about this Abitti Farms and some kind of co-op to charge this outragous amount of money.
 What is the farm doing to improve or sustain the birds, besides planting their crops. I also know someone who hunts in the Valley, the farm owner will not charge believes it is not right. I have not asked the name (won't to give it out).  I dont know of anyone who has gone down to hunt on this farm, but I think anyone that has, has a really bad urge to hunt (believe me I have the urge to hunt but not at $200 a day) and I could pay if I wanted. Hey use a little self control and spread the word that this is wrong. Make the El Centro farms think a little if next to no one goes to hunt.  


Bye all
 

songdog

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Just back from a bird hunt in ID.  I could write a small book on my opinions on this one but I'll spare everyone...

If you are going to spend $200 to hunt pheasants, think about flying to ID.  I spent $160 on a SouthWest airline ticket, $72 on an out of state license and slept and ate at a friends house (McDonald's is cheap and the Motel 6's there are $29/night).  I shot Blue Grouse, Ruffed Grouse, chukar, quail, pheasants, coyotes, red fox and ducks in the 3.5 days that I was there (pictures coming).

I hunted one morning in what they call a WMA (wildlife mgmt area) for pheasant and quail.  You get a $20 stamp on your license that lets you hunt this private land that has been leased by the state and managed for game.  Lots of birds to say the least.  The first covey of quail I jumped was about 50 birds and the second was over 100.  The wild pheasant population is augmented by plants in the spring so that you have fully wild birds by the fall.  Very good mgmt from a hunter's point of view.  In fact, the sign when you drove up to this place said "Welcome Hunters".

All that to say, CA is already an anti-hunting state, at least the southern part of the state which pretty much controls the politics.  It's just nice to know that the whole country isn't like that.
 


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