NON Lead Quail & Dove

radioleo

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Hello To All The JHO Wolfpack,

I may be doing some dove and quail hunting in central CA.

Who the HECK makes any NON-LEAD quail & dove loads. I guess we can kiss your $$#@!# good bye to the good old days of lead shot say 12 gauge 2 3/4 inch shell 1 1/8 oz # 7 1/2 @ $4.00 ~ $5.00 per box.

What can I NOW buy ANY suggestions would be great.

Please don't tell me I have to shoot steel at quail & dove.

Thank You

radioleo





 



Speckmisser

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Lead is fine for upland birds unless specifically prohibited on the property you're hunting (e.g. Tejon) or on certain federal waterfowl refuges. Check local rules, but the CA lead ban (condor protection act) does not apply.
 

myfriendis410

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You can shoot lead (where not specifically prohibited) at game birds such as quail, dove, and American crow as well as rabbits in season. You can NOT shoot lead shot at ground squirrels, coyotes, starlings, etc, as they are not game animals. Non lead is required for them in zone A. Rimfire is allowed for rabbits in season but not allowed for the same non game animals listed above.
 

troutndeer

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Lead is still fine, But winchester dose make a steel #7 load for upland use
 

Common Sense

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Lead is fine for birds in the "condor zone". But if deer season is open and you have a tag, them 7 1/2's will get you in trouble if they are not lead free.

I am a bird hunter, but always threw my rifle in the truck, just in case, during deer/bear season. That is now a big no-no. Also, there are no "non-lead" rifled slugs on the market (just sabots made for rifled shotguns). So I can't have slugs with me when quail hunting.

It really stinks.
 

sean english

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Common Sense
Can you explain why you cant have slugs or buck shots when hunting quail? Because then you are hunting big game and you have to use non lead ammo for them?
 

radioleo

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Hey Guys,

THANK YOU VERY MUCH for all your help !!!!!!!!!!

Now I can still use my 3 cases of quail/dove # 7 1/2 lead I have.

Good Huntin' to ALL ..........

radioleo





 

pbrdog

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CS, You can have quail loads with you when hunting deer. It is unlawfull to use any shot loads of any size for deer in Ca. Slug only. And if you have slugs while quail hunting, I seriously doubt any game warden would even think you're hunting quail with deer slugs. Not sure if you are reading entirely to far into the regs or just being jokingly sarcastic.
 

perdizgunner

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I think I will have to contact DFG for clarification on this issue cause I always carry a couple of 00 buckshot shells on my vest in the event of a Cat or some desperados....
 

troutndeer

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If the dfg says you cant cary 00 with you, just pick up some hevishot dead coyote rounds. They are pricey but I dont know what else you could do.
 

WildlifeBranch

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The non-lead restriction was only added to sections "while hunting big game", or "while hunting nongame".

The regulations while hunting small game mammals or upland game birds was not changed. If you are out hunting rabbits, quail, or tree squirrels for example, and a coyote or a ground squirrel pops up and you want to shoot it, you legally cannot have lead in your possession (because now you're hunting nongame).

The regulation was only "opened" for change related to big game regs and nongame. Best to inquire with local DFG law enforcement about how it will be interpreted/enforced.



Section 475


(2) Except as otherwise provided, it is unlawful to possess any projectile containing lead in excess of the amount permitted in subsection 475(f) and a firearm capable of firing the projectile while taking or attempting to take any nongame bird or nongame mammal within the area described in subsection 475(f). The possession of a projectile containing lead in excess of the amount allowed in subsection 475(f) without possessing a firearm capable of firing the projectile is not a violation of this section.

Section 353 Big game says:

1) Except as otherwise provided, it is unlawful to possess any projectile containing lead in excess of the amount permitted in subsection 353(h) and a firearm capable of firing the projectile while taking or attempting to take any big game within the area described in subsection 353(h). The possession of a projectile containing lead in excess of the amount allowed in subsection 353(h) without possessing a firearm capable of firing the projectile is not a violation of this section.
 

Common Sense

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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pbrdog @ Jun 14 2008, 01:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
CS, You can have quail loads with you when hunting deer. It is unlawfull to use any shot loads of any size for deer in Ca. Slug only. And if you have slugs while quail hunting, I seriously doubt any game warden would even think you're hunting quail with deer slugs. Not sure if you are reading entirely to far into the regs or just being jokingly sarcastic.[/b]
I hope you are right about having the quail loads; but it is my understanding that even though they are not legal for taking big game you cannot have lead shot shells or lead rim rifle shells while hunting big game.

I am more of a bird hunter than a deer hunter. But during deer season I have three slugs in my left pocket in case I see a deer. I cannot buy slugs for a smoothbore that are lead free, so therefore I cannot deer hunt while I am quail hunting.

Last year, my D8 deer was shot with a rifle, but my shotgun with lead pellets for quail was in the truck. I often deer hunt morning & evening and bird hunt in between. If you read the regs, I don't think it would be legal to have a shotgun with lead bird shot and a deer rifle with lead free ammo in your vehicle during deer season?

Last year when I shot my deer, my eleven year old grandson was standing three feet away from me with his shotgun with lead pellets. This year will it be legal for me to hunt deer with lead free ammo while my grandson who is under my supervision has lead birdshot in his shotgun or lead .22 bullets for squirrels or rabbits??????????

When I have asked DFG folks these questions, they say it is a gray area and we don't know what the policy will be.
 

pbrdog

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True. It is a gray area. I suppose if the game warden was to live to the letter of the law, they could probably site you for just being out hunting. Same with why cops don't sit outside recycling centers siting people for having open containers (alcohol) in the vehicle. I would think that the game wardens would use the "common sense" factor in such a situation.
 

Common Sense

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I am driving up to the cabin with my shotgun. I didn't bring a rifle as I had no plans to hunt deer. I do have my "carry" .38 special with lead bullets.

I notice some deer on the hillside. It is private property and I don't have my rifle; but still I stop to look at them(most of us would). I have no intention of shooting at them. A game warden drives around the corner and sees me glassing the deer. If he uses common sense, I am going to be cited.
 

Dave in LB

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Estate Cartridge Company is making a selection of 7.5 and 8 shot size in steel I think 6's will follow. Just to answer the question of who is making it. I saw the Winchester around too. Thyis is a good topic as I thought the Condor range restrictions were more intensive than you all seem to believe.
 

CA_pheasant

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The place I'm hunting dove opener requires non-toxic ammo for ALL HUNTING. And carrying lead ammo of any kind in your vehicle is prohibited.
I found steel #7 12ga 1oz loads for < $8/box of 25 including shipping. Estate brand - good enough for dove.
 

radioleo

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Hello Wildlife Branch,

So here is my question if I am within the CONDOR AREAS lets say the San Luis Obispo, Kern, Santa Barbara, Monterey Counties, or the Owens Valley at Bishop, CA and I am hunting for upland game such as quail, dove, chukar, turkey, or pheasant I MAY still shoot lead shotgun shells ?


I have recently acquired some Winchester Supreme E-Tip 30-06 centerfire ammo for pig hunting which was an approved NON Lead ammo on the DFG web page.





 

ooja

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I read this thread through, and I just received my tags for this year's deer season. With it there was a handout on new regulations limiting the use of lead projectiles for big game and non game. Everything was pretty much as was expected, with the exception of:

"In addition, while hunting these species, in this area hunters may not possess any lead projectiles/ammunition and a firearm capable of firing that lead projectile or ammunition"

I think Common Sense had it pretty much in the 10 ring on this one, if you are hunting deer, no lead can be in your possession. I'm not sure you can have your shotgun in your truck with lead shells and your deer rifle in hand with non lead. I don't believe you can have a shotgun and both non lead slugs and leaded birdshot in your vest. No side arms with lead cartridges while bird hunting either. It's getting pretty interesting, this legislation.
 

WildlifeBranch

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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (radioleo @ Jun 24 2008, 03:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
So here is my question if I am within the CONDOR AREAS lets say the San Luis Obispo, Kern, Santa Barbara, Monterey Counties, or the Owens Valley at Bishop, CA and I am hunting for upland game such as quail, dove, chukar, turkey, or pheasant I MAY still shoot lead shotgun shells ?[/b]
Owens Valley is not in the condor lead free area. For all those areas, yes it is still legal to use lead shot (statewide) - shotgun shells for upland game as well as for rabbits and tree squirrels. Not for coyotes, big game (lead shot is illegal for big game anyhow), or other nongame wildlife species (rodents for example).
 

pbrdog

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I'm thinking that why would a game warden even think you were deer hunting with 7-1/2 shot? There has got to be a common sense factor here somewhere.
 


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