Schwarzenegger signs California lead-bullet ban

[snake river rufus]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (WildlifeBranch @ Nov 4 2007, 11:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

While I would not go as far as Snake River did, we in CDFG do have some concern that some of the work is being done, and conclusions being drawn, by scientists who are not ecologists/biologists. There are however biologists involved in the condor work, as there are DVMs.

Condor work can surely be shown to need more work on food habits and behavior-- ie more field studies than laboratory studies. Hopefully, this last year of focus and scrambling has adequately shown where data on condor and what affects them are lacking.

In the biologist/ecologist versu DVM thinking, there has long been concern that DVM's were too focused on the individual animal while we bio/ecol. types think in terms of populations.

Snake R. (or others) -- send an email to wildlifestrategy@dfg.ca.gov with "method of take" in the subject to get the env. doc. on this topic from dfg. Suggest looking at App. 3.

AZ game & fish website also has some of the science-- AZ situation is way different than CA though.[/b]

Hi, The AZ g&f information is the information leading me to believe that there were no biologists involved in the study. We were dicussing it on another board.
Thanks for the link, i'll use it.

 

[snake river rufus]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rancho Loco @ Nov 4 2007, 11:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Thanx Snake River. I'm at two stars now!!

[/b]

You are welcome. Anyone who blindly accepts a study needs a wake up. Here is the C.V. from on the toxicolgist from the study you cited
. Dr. Gwiazda received a bachelor’s degree in geology from the Hebrew University of Jerusalem, Israel, in 1989, and a Master of Science and Ph.D. in geochemistry from Columbia University in New York, in 1992 and 1995, respectively

He has done toxicology work for the EPA so if you accept the EPA I guess we can accept Dr. Gwiazda as an authority.

From the Church study
isotopic composition that approached the composition of the lead in ammunition. In the most severely lead-poisoned birds, the blood lead matched exactly the composition of the lead in ammunition,

Now I'm just a dumb engineer but this does not make sense to me. Isotope composition does not change with the amount.

At least she is presenting to a peer review magazine any major flaws should be exposed .

 

[Rancho Loco]

Blindly? Yup - you got me, einstein. Bird's ain't got no crops, either.

 

[snake river rufus]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rancho Loco @ Nov 4 2007, 05:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Blindly? Yup - you got me, einstein. Bird's ain't got no crops, either.[/b]

I'll have a talk with the the zoo guy tomorrow. sfb

 

[Freedivr2]

OK boys...............frankly, I'd really like to get past all the B.S. and pissin and moanin to understand where in the hell is the smoking gun? What specific evidence was found (i.e. a piece of a Barnes X or a Nosler partition in the craw of one of these wimpy buzzards) that led the "experts" to believe it's lead bullets that is causing this buzzards demise?

Anybody got any clue or, is it, as it seems, all conjecture?