Sighting in

Glass eye

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This is my third time to sight in my rifle, the first time was with a scope, the second time with open sights (tag requirement) and now again with the scope.
The problem I encounter is that after about the 5th or 6th shot my grouping goes to pieces. This time of year here at home the temperature averages 105-110 and I think the barrel gets too hot by the 6th round. What do you think?
 



PaPaBob

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Absolutely correct. Summertime is a bad time to sight in. Even in the fall if you sight in for any length of time without a cool down period you get erratic groupings.
 

MEF

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Are you running a spit patch between shots? If not, then your groups are definitely going to open up. My
Mike
 

Glass eye

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I always clean the barrel after each shot.
Should I try sighting in at 50 yards rather than 100 ?
Also I see a pattern where the first shot is usually wild, the second and third are good and then it goes wild again. Any ideas?
 

MEF

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Could be a bunch of things. You may need to space your fore end away from your barrel by placing a washer on the mounting screw. I've found that when shooting off a bench I need to place the rifle on the rest as close to the trigger guard as I can get and place it there every time. Different resting points would change the group. I see by your other post you are going to hunt elk? I used a 348 grain Powerbelt aerotip in front of 150 grains of Pyrodex to get the elk pictured in my avatar. 1.5" groups at 100 yards. I got better groups with 295 grain Powerbelts and 100 grains of Triple 7 though, 1" at 100 yards. I sacrificed a little accuracy for the bigger bullet. They both have the same hollowed out areafor the hollowpoint design but the 348 has more base material. Am I making sense? Also, are the scope mounts tight? I had a rifle that wasn't grouping well and I couldn't figure out why until I checked the scope mounts that have NEVER been loose before. They were loose. LOL! Good luck! Mike
 

BUSTEDKNEE

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I had the same problem, along with some others. I worked on it all summer.

Take everything you hear from the "experts" with a grain of salt (Myself included). I have found many people simply repeat something they have heard.

I tried the 25acp cartridge ignition system and found it to be a complete waste of time and money for me. It was just as dirty as the normal breech plug, accuracy was no better and I had to clean and re-prime all that brass.

I had been shooting MLs for a while but the State of Alaska required their ML class for ML-Only hunts so I attended it a few years ago. Great class! First thing we did in the class? Cover the basics.
So after much struggling that is what I did as well.

First, mount a good scope. Not a cheap junker. Don't worry about the sights untill you have develped a good load. Leupold good. Burris bad, wouldn't take the recoil

Buy several kinds of primers. I found the CCI 209M (M=muzzle loader?) were the most consistant for my Encore, shot to shot.

Pick a good bullet. Since I was going for Elk in CO I could not shoot sabots. I tried those Prescision Rifle conicals as well as some others but found the PowerBelt 348 grain bullets gave me the best accuracy.

CO also requires loose powder so I went with 777. I tried two granulations. fffg was ever so slightly more accurate. I found any load from about 60 grains to 120 grains to shoot about the same, accuarcy-wise. The recoil is different of course and the point of impact changes but the group size remains the same, around 2 inches.

As has been mentioned, resting the fore-end when shooting can affect group size. I mounted a short bipod. This has worked well on several of my rifles. This way the same point gets the pressure each and every time.

Some folks insist on a fouling shot before loading up for hunting. I could not see any difference with my Encore from a clean barrel to a fouled barrel. But read on.

I tried swabbing between shots. 1 patch, 2 patch, and 3 patch, as well as no patch. If I have time (such as when shooting on the range) I prefer 1 patch with 4 drops of water on it. It didn't seem to help the accuracy but it does make loading the next bullet a lot easier. And as long as I run the 1 patch I can continue shooting all day.
My second option is no patch. This is what will most likely occur in a hunting situation so it is a good idea to check it out, and it did happen to me. My accuracy does not drop off, it is just harder to seat the bullet.

This brings me to what I think was negativily affecting my accuracy the most. Seating the powder and bullet. It must be the same each time or the velocites will be different!

After firing the first shot there is some crud left in the "chamber area". Swabbing can remove most of this but my belief is some will still remain.

Here is my procedure:
Drop the powder. Bounce the rifle on the recoil pad 3 times to settle the powder. If you don't think this makes a difference, drop 100 grains of loose powder in a clear loading tube, then shake it down. Now you have 80 grains by volume. So different measures of powder will affect the point of impact as will the air space in the powder if it is not "settled".

With a clean barrel, and after settling the powder, seat the bullet firmly. (PowerBelts are slightly undersize so I find them fairly easy to seat even in a dirty barrel). Mark your rod with the bullet seated firmly.

As has been mentioned, pressure on the forend is important. I free-floated the fore end then installed rubber washers. I know the free-floating is a good thing (since the fore end was touching on one side) and I'm sure the rubber grommets just stand it out a little more and can't hurt.

Once the sighting-in is complete, the scope can come off (if law requires it) and some good sights need to be attached. I missed two huge bull moose when my Encore rear sight was stuck down. Apparently a bit of corrision held the sight all the way down after it got compressed in transit. I went to a Williams peep but it would shoot loose after a few shots. I replaced it with a peep from Brownells that mounts on the scope mount. I have been very pleased with this sight.
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/Pro...itle=PEEP+SIGHT

When you reload, the ramrod should go down to the exact same spot time after time after time. If not, you have done one of 3 things:
1. You didn't seat the bullet all the way down. This can happen during an excited reload.
2. Crud in the "chamber area" is stopping your bullet. Or
3. Your powder hasn't "Settled".

When I go to the range now, I take 348 grain PowerBelts, CCI 209M primers, and 777 fffg powder.
I measure 120 grains of powder into a clear tube then shake it down and add more until I get 120 grains.
Drop the powder in the barrel then bounce the rifle 3-times on the recoil pad.
Seat the bullet to the mark on my ramrod. If I have fired a few shots already, that last 1/2 inch or so is tough. I carry a piece of concave antler in my pocket to protect my hand from the end of the ramrod.

Most of my groups run about 2 inches. Sometimes a little less and sometimes a little more. But those large groups and the reoccurring flyers have disappeared.

I hope this helps.

 

RandyWakeman

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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Glass eye @ Aug 3 2006, 12:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
The problem I encounter is that after about the 5th or 6th shot my grouping goes to pieces. This time of year here at home the temperature averages 105-110 and I think the barrel gets too hot by the 6th round. What do you think?[/b]
Think you are exactly right.
 


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