USO at it again??

subfan

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Rumor is he filed suit against Nevada. Can anyone confirm? If so, AZ was the begining of the end...
 

DAWG

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Absolute best case for an AZ resident would be a legal way out of the ruling. Absolute worst case would to be singled out exclusivly. Every other state getting the same would be somewhere in the middle. Really, even if no nonresident tags were issued, an AZ resident has to figure on going hunting as a nonresident if he wants to hunt bull elk on a regular basis.
 

Pa Ridge Runner

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here's my take on this USO suit, not that anyone asked for it but I'm getting tired of listening to AZ residents as well as other res. of elk populated states whine about Non resident tags allotments:

Horray for USO! I own as much of the National Forest as anyother American, yet because I do not live in a state that has many elk I am forced to travel west if I want to hunt them. Same for mule deer, goats, bighorns, etc. I get thrown into a draw for roughly 10% of the tags. Why not an equal draw where EVERYONE has an equal chance to draw if that tag is to be used on National Forest or BLM?
Ex. I have gone to Montana to hunt deer. 6 years straight I was denied a tag in the general draw. I hunt BLM property. Finally I paid the scalper's fee for a landowner/outfitter sponsored tag $750 so I could hunt there just once.
Residents seem to forget that it is we NR whom foot the bill for most game management and without us the $$ wouldn't be there for any of it public land or private.
 

COUESNAM

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PA Ridge runner,

That is easy for a non- resident to say. If they were to implement your ridiculous idea it would be just like the lottery. Everybody's chances of being drawn would be almost impossible. Why don't you try pulling your head out of your ___ and open your mind a little to how Arizona residents may feel? This whole issue is revolving around more money for USO.
 

COHunter

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What folks have to remember is that we don't have the game populations that Eastern states have.

Colorado landmass is 3 times larger than Pennsylvania, and if you combine every game animal in the state of CO (Deer, Elk, Pronghorn, Moose, Etc) it would still not equal the number of Deer that reside in PA.

But you want to go to your local Wal-mart and buy you PA hunting license for under $30 which includes your deer & turkey tags and hunt every year for multiple weeks (Archery, Muzz, Rifle) and then come take away a tag from a guy that might not even get the oppurtunity to hunt Biggame at all in is home state.

Is our fault that there is public land in our states ? Is it our fault that Elk live here ? Lobby your Game Commission to have more Elk relocated, just like most Western state's did.

As for Federal land, you can access Natl' Forest land 365 days a year if you like, just like I can. But if you want to hunt, you need to get a tag issued by the state. Just because my dream area is 90% BLM land, doesn't mean the "State" is gonna give me a tag to hunt there. If I go to PA and hunt on Federal land, can I hunt on Sunday ? or does the "STATE of PA" say I can't because they manage the hunting ?

If my Son goes to Penn State, is he gonna pay the same tuition that your kid would ???

There are Perks and Downfalls to living anywhere in the U.S. Yes we all live in the same country, but every state has different rules. Just ask everyone from CA here if they would like to have a statewide concealed carry permit like every law abiding citizen of Colorado is allowed to have. Their state say's they can't be trusted with a pistol whereas my state say's I can. If you don't like it.......MOVE
 

scr83jp

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Here's my thoughts with hunting on Federal Land that states really don't control for example when Arizona set tag limits for a northern Arizona hunting zone on federal lands the US F&W Service overruled the state and reduced the number of tags for mule deer by over half.There should be a federal hunting license for hunting federal lands with everyone paying the same fee.Its done in Yellowstone, you buy a federal permit to fish not a state license.That would stop the scalping of non-residents who pay exorbitant tag fees to hunt federal land where the elk,deer,moose,antelope,bears are habituated.
 

wmidbrook

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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>
Why don't you try pulling your head out of your ___ and open your mind a little to how Arizona residents may feel? This whole issue is revolving around more money for USO.[/b]

Cousenam>>you're doing a disservice to residents of Arizona by using such strong language to express how you feel......tone it down a notch would ya?

Not everyone here thinks that this issue is about more money for USO....others may view that as a Naive opinion. Plus, your point is highly debatable and does not reflect the sentiments of everyone here.
 

'Ike'

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It is about money, wether you want to believe it or not 'wmidbrook'!!! Sooner or later people will figure this out, just may take some time and by then it'll be to late......
 

Coues

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PA Ridge Runner,

Who exactly is keeping you from accessing Federal Land?
 

fishhead

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:
I believe that the states should be able to regulate hunting in their state any way they want.

When the founding fathers set up our government structure, the federal government was only going to regulate those things beyond the states ability IE: national defense, postal service, treaties, etc.. Now they seem to have their finger into everything!

If the state looses too much money by limiting nonresidents, they'll change their rules.

All that said, I hope to get a nonresident leftover cow elk tag for Colorado.
 

COUESNAM

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Sorry if I offended you Wmidbrook. I've put in for Bull Elk in AZ for 10 yrs and never been drawn and I'm just a little irritated that because of USO's greed, my future chance of getting a tag for my boy and I are cut in half. I don't have the money to put in for New Mexico, Utah, Colorado etc so it looks like my chances of getting a chance to hunt Elk in my home state are pretty slim now.
 

gc4279

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If you were to remove all federal infuences don't you think they would take thier federal funding(NR tax $) with them. I don't think any state could afford to maintain public lands on thier own. It would'nt be long until they found more commercial ways of obtainig the funds they need and none of it would be good for sportsmen. I don't know what would be a good balance for resedent/non-resedent tags. I don't think it's fare for a state to use federal funding to cover 90% of the cost but only offer 10% available access.
 

Cahunter

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I have to say that it is outragous that Nevada can charge me 1000 dollars for an elk tag when someone that live there only has to pay 35 or 40 $$. NR tags should be no more then double the cost of of a resident tag. As far as the limits to outof state tags, I think there should be some because if you live there you should have a better chance a a tag then others.

If people don't think its about money then just look at Alaska. You have to pay a guide if you want to hunt brown bears, as well as buy an out of state tag. Some areas there are so many Browns that they wanted to repeal the rule and let non resident hunt brown. You heard all the outfitters and guide cry foul. they said that poeple don't have the experience to hunt dangerious game but thats not true. Just you live in Alaska dosen't make you an god hunter. You can hunt deer in the same areas where there are browns and they don't care.

People seem to forget that if others come to your state to hunt not only are they buying tag and licences. They also shop in your stores and stay in hotels.
 

Monsterbull

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I'm new to the subject so I will not pretend to be well-versed in the details. From my understanding, since the regulation and management of wildlife are the sole pervue of the individual states (with the notable exception of migratory waterfowl), it would seem proper that states have the authority to determine their own rules. This is supposed to be the case no matter the amount of Federal land. Thus, in any and all instances, the ability of non-residents to hunt in another state is granted at the discretion of that state. Technically, if any state wanted to restrict non-residents 100%, they are free to do so. That they do not is a question of balancing many game managment issues with bringing in funds to the state, in the interest of all the residents of that state.

I certainly don't like paying higher fees as a non-resident but I can agree with the states having this power. It would seem to me then, that the 9th Circus Court completely overstepped on their ruling (again). Basically, they swallowed the USO contention that this was a violation of the Commerce Clause of the US constitution. I don't know how it will shake out but I'm afraid this has the potential to be a very dangerous precedent. USO did the sport of hunting no favors.....after all they said this isn't about hunting, it's about "commerce".
 

Cahunter

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One more thing is when peopl started to turn hunting into a business then they opened themselves up to this kind of action. Not that I want a free for all for tags but ther has to be a better system. One that would be more agreeable to both sides. Another thing that the high cost of that are change is that it makes hunting into more of a rich mans sport . I would love to go out of state and hunt everyother year or so but I can afford to pay 4500$$ to go hunting every year. It also makes it harder to take kids hunting, if you are going to take your kid on a hunting trip now your talking about 9,000 dollars for a trip.
 

Pa Ridge Runner

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Coues: I'm pretty sure if I grab my bow and chase elk on Federal land in Az I will be very harshly restricted without that high dollar tag in my pocket!
If you cannot afford to take your kid hunting in another state for bull elk, tough. Get a second or third job, that's what I must do to buy a NR tag in some states.
It's a mean world, to the victors go the spoils.
I've put in every year since Pa. has had an elk lottery draw, never have I been drawn. Yet every year NR come here with their tag and hunt on Federal land (ANF). If I want to hunt elk I got to go where the elk are. Same with you!
 

eddiehsf

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by couesnam
I don't have the money to put in for New Mexico, Utah, Colorado etc so it looks like my chances of getting a chance to hunt Elk in my home state are pretty slim now.
by couesnam
Couesnam why is that?, is it due to the fact theat NR Fees are so much higher?

Residents want:
90/10 then let me NR pay the same as you the Resident
80/20 then make the NR pay 2x the Residents
70/30 then make the NR pay 3x the Residents
60/40 then make the NR pay 4x the Residents


I have no problem with a resident having better odds, but not better odds and a much better price. I also feel the state of CA is wrong by not letting NR hunt certain animals here. I feel it is BS that you must hunt with a guide in Alaska, or a guide or resident to hunt the wilderness areas of Wyoming.

MONEY is it, the STATES want to keep residents happy with "low" tag fees, so they say sorry sucker to the NR. The states are no different than USO and all the other guide services that hunt in several states. Thats right there are more outfitters than just USO that will gain from this.

I also would like to know how do you feel about the AZ RESIDENT GUIDES that work for USO? They are RESIDENTS, they pay taxes in your state, they make there money from the NR and RESIDENT hunters that use USO booking service.

I hope things change in the way NR are treated in all states, that way one day you can afford to hunt New Mexico, Utah, Colorado etc., with a guide or WITHOUT ONE.

eddiehsf
 

COUESNAM

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I do not have a problem w/ NR's hunting elk in AZ. I do have a problem not getting drawn in 10 yrs and then finding out my chances are even more slim. An AZ bull tag is so tough to draw for residents, why allow more non residents to even make it worse. Hunting is becoming a rich mans sport. I believe states should allot the majority of there tags to residence which is how it was being done w/ the 10% cap. With that cap gone, the residence have a much more difficult chance of being drawn.
 

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