A way to GREATLY improve public land pig hunting?

[JungleBoy]

After reading the post regarding the Carizzo pigs, and having been a California pig hunter for about 5 years (with VERY VERY limited success), I decided to post this, and see what you guys think:

In all honesty, what I would REALLY like to see (which, in my opinion, it will be REALLY GOOD for public land pig hunting) is to impose a season, and maximum number of pigs per year/per hunter (like deer). I know that pigs are supposed to be 'prolific' breaders, and that they can multiply like rats and cause damage to crops, etc....

However, how about this for a solution: A 4 month season for pigs (when they are least likely to be pregnant or nursing), and a maximum of 3 pigs per hunter per year (of course, this is just an example. The figures can be adjusted based on scientific data). Now, this will ONLY apply on public lands. That is, if you want to shoot out 30 pigs in one day, you can, but on private land ONLY. They can leave things be the way they are for private lands, that is no limit (as long as you have tags), and no closed season.

This will 'control' and reduce the population of pigs on 'private land', where some wine and complain about the 'damage' to their crops, etc (but yet, some want to charge $600+ for a pig), and actually PUSH THEM ONTO PUBLIC LAND, as during the 'public land off-hunting-season', there will be A LOT LESS pressure on public lands, than on private lands!

What do you think?

 

[Bishop]

I don't know if I would favor a season and limit. Pig hunting is the only big game hunting you can do year long. And the tags are the best deal out of all the tags and stamps we get stuck paying for.
Pigs are extremely prolific, the only reason they're not prolific on public land is because of the shortage of food and water during the hot months. They're not getting shot out on public land they just go where the food is. I would rather see habitat improvement on public lands that would provide desirable areas to draw the pigs off private farms.

 

[traxman]

I tend to agree with Bishop. The nature of the Pig season is one of the things that makes pig hunting great. However, were it proven, through study, that a limited season would increase public pig proliferation,

then I have to say, I may go for it. That's a big however though.

Habitat improvement is the biggest issue for us public land guys, and I would support an effort to help increase that! (Dare I say an increase in pig tag prices, in order to build more habitat?)

I do wish there were more of these piggies around for us non-rich guys to hunt. All the success stories of private hunting has really got me jonesin' for some pork in my freezer!

traxman

 

[Speckmisser]

First of all, Jungleboy, I'm not knocking you for having the idea. I think it's good to keep thinking of possible solutions. The "right one" is out there somewhere.

That said...

I'm 100% with Bishop and Trax. No seasons!

The biggest reason is pure selfishness on my part... pig hunting keeps me sane between deer seasons. Ducks are OK, and quail, well, I've never been nuts about quail hunting... it just gets me in the woods at the end of January. But pig hunting keeps me hunting right into the heat of summer (and once or twice during the heat of summer). If they limited the season, it would almost definitely overlap with something else and the benefit of being able to go any ol' time would become moot.

I also agree with Bishop that limiting the pressure on public land pigs isn't going to bring them back. The fact is, at least in my experience, the public lands aren't really getting hit all that hard anyway...with the exception of a few places within a mile of the road. A few hard-hunting folks get their pigs every year. A few more hard-hunting folks just haven't found our honey hole yet. And the rest just aren't hunting hard enough (which is OK with me). Just like deer hunting, if you get into the back country you'll have much better odds and lots less pressure. But the public lands just don't offer a whole heck of a lot of food sources, especially compared to private lands.

Back in NC, the Wildlife Resources Commission (NC's DFG) manages public lands with food plots, controlled burns, and access points. While I realize that public lands there are a lot smaller than they are here, I'd love to see some of that kind of work happening on pig and deer areas here in CA. They do it for upland birds and waterfowl, why not for deer and pigs? If they're going to use more of my tag and ammo money, that's how I'd like to see it used.

Gotta say, too, that odds are pretty good that limiting public land hog hunting to a few months per year would increase the damage and competition with native species on public lands too. As much as I love to hunt pigs, I'd rather see deer and bears in their native habitat.

 

[JungleBoy]

I appreciate everyones input so far. I do realize that habitat improvement is perhaps the most effective method of increasing the public land pig poluplation. However, it is also the hardest one to accomplish, as it involves food plots, controled burns, sources of water, etc. It might be doable (and CERTAINLY worthwile for the long run) in a specific area/plot, however, take the Los Padres for example.... Habitat improvement in only 10% of this 1.7 million acre+ forest would mean 170,000 acres worth of 'habitat' improvement. And that is only 10% of only one public forest. Once again, it is truly THE MOST desirable method of increasing the carrying capacity of wildlife and game, and not just for wild pigs, but for deer, bear, and just about everything else.

However, knowing our natural resource management agencies.... I would not hold my breath. They take for ever to do something that is easy and common sense... Can you imagine what it would take for them to implement such a big poject???

What the seasons/limits will do is 'encourage' the private land so called 'pests' to seek refuge onto the public lands. While the daily water needs of a wild pig greatly exceeds that of a deer, I believe the season/limits are, at least partially, the reason why we see LOTS of decent public land deer, and a good number of them too!

I too enjoy hunting public land pigs all year long, and hike in way way deep, often backpacking for a couple of days, whenever possible. However, I've come to a realization: There IS NO HONEY HOLE!!!! A VERY small percentage of my public land pig hunting have been successfull, but I consider myself VERY fortunate. In my opinion, a successfull public land hunt currently will require the following components:

- Getting FAR away from the beaten path.... long hikes...
- Some skill / patience / perseverence...
- Some good pair of binos, and glassing (spotting) large areas.
- Choosing your days and locations carefully
- MOST IMPORTANT ITEM: LOTS and LOTS and LOTS of PURE LUCK !!!

My encounters with them (having hunted the SAME area many many times) have been incidental! They may be 'crossing over' today, but gone tomorrow.

Furthermore, on the really deep hikes, and in at least 2 locations, I've actually passed on a shot after seeing them.... I know..... STUPID..... However, I had a hard time picturing getting myself out of there, let alone me and a pig.....


Here is a modified 'virtual proposal'.... How about a limit of ONE pig, per person, per week. This will prevent someone from wiping out the entire herd.

Furthermore, having a season per zone bases, but a zone always open... For example, having 3 'pig' zones....Zone A will open for pig hunting a month (or whatever), then Zone B will be open for a month (Zone A closed), and then Zone C.... Then alternating back to A. This way, there will ALWAYS be an open zone for hunting them, but will give the other 2 zone a breather...

 

[shaginator]

More public land pigs would be nice to hunt. Your suggestions are all reasonable, but they assume DFG agrees with you and wants a healthy pig population.

Quite the contrary -- they want eradication, from public lands at least.

As you know -- Field biologists, etc. hate feral pigs. They're not native.
They rut, cause erosion, sediment, compete for same food native wildlife eat. Eradicate!

The goal is to manage healthy populations of native wildlife - bear, deer, etc. Note: This is good.

This takes me to Henry Coe State Park (HCSP), a local place. 87,000 acres. Hogs are a huge problem. Dilemma: no hunting allowed, not even in the most remote areas. Park sez something must be done, but instead of special permits, they hire trapper(s). Weird.

There are already special drawings for places like Lake Sonoma. I think it wouldn't take much more work to try to get DFG/State to implement this kind of program in places like HCSP.

 

[Kickaha]

I'd like to cast my vote in the "no new restrictions" category. While I know that my chances of getting a public land pig are slim to none, I don't mind at all. I like the fact that I can go out and hunt pigs any day of the week, 365 days a year. To me, that's worth more than increasing my chances. If I really wanted to increase my chances, I'd just to on a pig-o-rama hunt. Even though the price is $300, that's little compared to what I'll spend tracking down the public pig.

I do appreciate all your ideas. However, shaginator's post really tells it like it is. Even the Nature Conservancy, not usually thought of as hunter-friendly, is out to eradicate wild pigs.

 

[feelinducky]

Hey shag, where is Henry Coe State Park?

 

[shaginator]

Western boundary is just east of Morgan Hill.

Morgan Hill is north of Gilroy, south of San Jose.

 

[MNHNTR]

This is My3 cents.... I've hunted public and private land and without a doubt private is the way to go if you want to see lots ofanimals. Without knowing the exact statistics the DFG has compiled on pig hunting i really cant speak wth any informed voice. I might tend to agree with a long season, but then again it is nice to plan a hunt at any time of the year.

 

[Speckmisser]

Shaggy,

You just want them to open up Henry Coe so you can hunt practically in your backyard!

Hmm... come to think of it, Henry Coe is practically my backyard too.

I do wish they'd open it up, even with limited draw hunts like Lake Sonoma. There are areas in that park that almost never see a day hiker or park user. Even if it were archery only, it would be an instant success.

There are some areas over in the Santa Cruz mountains that ought to be opened up for an occasional hunt too. You ought to see what the pigs are doing to Big Basin State Park! Actually had them root under my truck while I was camped there last year.

 

[Live2hunt]

How about if we have DFG raise the price of pig tags to about the same price as deer tag. Have DFG use the extra money in raising pigs and release (let's say 10 pigs) them onto public land once or twice a month just like what they are doing for trout.

I too would like a chance to walk into Henry Coe State Park with a bow or rifle. Too many pigs in that park. Caught a little ten pounder with my bare hands one time. Took some pics of it and gave it back to mama.




L2H

 

[HOGHUNTER714]

I would have to agree with Bishop on this one...I dont like the idea of a season on Pig Hunting. Its the only thing I can do year round. But, I do wish the DFG would come up with something to improve the habitat on "Public Land". Cause as it stands now, it sucks. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Speckmisser]

Live2Hunt,

They'd never go for the release plan. Bear in mind that hogs are a problem species, and most ecologists and game managers don't want to add to the problem. Like Shaggy said, the original plan was eradication. Seeing that failed, the next plan is to allow unlimited hunting to keep the herd down. The only reason for even having pig tags (according to DFG literature) is to provide a way of tracking the harvest statistics in order to follow the population growth. The $7 or so each book generates barely covers the management costs... which is all it was intended to do.

Back to the original proposal...

The reason public land pig hunting is so tough is primarily the lack of food sources. That's really the bottom line. The pigs aren't there because they have easy pickings on private land... barley, grain crops, cattle feed, etc. Even if you decreased hunting on public land while private land hunts continue or increase, the pigs aren't likely to come off the private land.

Private land ranches that are killing the hogs as pests, or charging access fees aren't driving the animals onto public land either. In the area I like to hunt near Coalinga, the barley farmers and their friends shoot day and night. But you're still hard-pressed to find a pig on the nearby public land. The pigs just move to a different area of the ranch...maybe bedding and occasionally watering on public land, but still feeding on the ranch.

Keep in mind too, that hunting ranches that are charging hunters to shoot pigs will do whatever is necessary to keep that income source coming. If that means rotating or decreasing pressure on their herds, they'll do it... never fear. If they see their pigs leaving due to hunting pressure, they'll stop hunting the area. As a result, the only thing that would be accomplished by setting a limited season would be to limit how often public land hunters can get out... and probably providing a little more income for the private ranches.

The only benefit of this plan to public land hunters might be the first couple of weeks of pig season, when the pigs haven't been harrassed by hunters for a couple of months. I'm sure that'll have them moving a little more carelessly at first, but once the pressure turns on, that'll be the end of it. Of course, crossover with deer and upland hunting seasons means the pigs will still encounter hunters during most of the year.

As to one pig per person, per week... I think most public land hunters are happy with one pig per person per year. A very few public land hunters kill more than a couple a year, and almost no one is likely to eradicate an entire herd... even over the space of a season. The limit would be pretty much pointless. Oh, and remember, they only recently removed the one pig per day limitation.

Might be interesting to see some kind of rotating zone thing, though, especially if it was well thought out and fair. I'm still not sure it would do a lot to improve the public land pig populations. More likely, it'll just concentrate the hunters in each zone, especially at the beginning of the rotation.

Finally...

DFG walks a fine line between hunters, environmentalists, farmers, and the non-hunting public (which includes the anti-hunting public). Their response to the infestation of hogs in the state has to remain balanced with the needs and desires of all of these groups. I'd lay odds that, for DFG to intentionally improve hog habitat on public land would bust that balance outright.

 

[Cahunter]

it would be nice if dfg improved the pulic land habitat. Plant some fod plots for pigs and the deer. I live in morgan hill and have hunted ranches that are behind Coe park. That park is huge and should be opened for pig hunting, I asked a ranger one time and he told me that they don't want hunting in the park because someone might shoot some hikers. I say they should colse that park for 4 months and let people go in there and shot some hogs, which are all over the place in there.

 

[shadow]

Just something of note....The more pigs you have in an area the less deer you will have as well. I have a private lease that I have seven feeders going year round. Why...I don't know but the pigs seem to stick to 2 or 3 of the feeders and the deer are very few and far between around those yet the ones that don't get the pig traffic always have a good amount of deer around.

With that said I also hunt pig's year round..one to keep my bow/rifle skills up and two because I love the meat. You also don't have to worry about tags, limits etc...we pay enough to hunt everything else around the area. If you have a big enough wallet you could hunt "Exotics" year round on Ranches as well.

 

[Hogskin]

No new laws, no new taxes, no new fees. We've got too much of all of the above in this state. A season would put oinkers on public land during the off season. Once they heard gunshots they'd haul bacon for private land where you'd still get charged 400 bucks to shoot one.

Regards,
Paul

 

[sportyg]

Hmm, should have looked this site over before I posted on the other.. After reading the comments here I've got to go along. But as we all know the DFG is not going to manage our wildlife or lands in any way shape or forum that is going to improve hunting. They don't have the power to do so.. Don't know if they would, even if they could. Everything is controled by the county supervisors, or the forest service or so it seems.

 

[New Pig Hunter]

I agree with most of what's already been posted here, and that is to say that year-round hog hunting has got to be one of the last fun things the politician's haven't hosed up here in Kali.
Somehow in their benevolence and foolishness and "good intentions" to ruin most everything, they've (so far) overlooked hog hunting. Please, in our own good intentions, let's not bring this oversight to their attention..... then everything will be lost: year-round fun and cheap tags.
Yeh, public land hunting is tough. But even at it's worst, at least we can get out there year-round with armament in-hand and try.
Besides, the pigs won't be aware of our intent to help them re-populate public land. I'm surrounded by pigs here in my engineer's cubicle and I guarantee you they haven't the slighest interest in doing what I think they should be doing.... and half the time I know for certain they aren't even thinking !!
Nope, let's try our best to keep year-round hog hunting below the politician's radar screen because they are NOT here to help !!

New Pig Hunter

 

[paulc]

shaginator hit the nail onthe head. they are trying to eradicate pigs not create a more booming population.