DFG arrests 3 in Tulare County

[cincoflatspirate]

And no I don't roll up with guns sticking out, full camo, a big buck tied to the front of my truck and start huntin when theres people hiking, riding horses, etc., I move on when theres people that look like they would be bothered by what I'm doing.

 

[Hntrjohn]

The most recent event was some hounds chased a bear into our camp at first none wanted to leave finally the hounds left then we coaxed the bear out with some yelling and some rocks.


Were these actualy trained hounds, or just stray dogs. No hounds that I hunted behind ever left a tree with a bear in it without somebody with a leadrope taking them away

 

[hicntry]

Damn I despise people that bring horses into good hunting country. Soon as they show up they seem to think the world has to watch out for them because they just happen to own some of the dumbest animals walking the face of the earth....aside from their owners. They expect "everyone" to tiptoe so the horses aren't spooked and all the while those dumb animals are tearing up the trails and leaving mountains of crap around every good campsite. They should be prohibited on federal land along with their owners IMHO

 

[Maverick]

Would I be pissed if a hunter running dog that were barking a yelping were near me ? Hell yeah , but no more pissed off at the group of 20 that are hunting together beating bushes, whistling and yelling. I have never ran into anyone running dogs during deer season. THey have just as much right to hunt as I do .As for the family of tree huggers hear dogs bark all night.. It hunting season oh well.

 

[Maverick]

the only thing worse then horse people are the motorcycle people..lol

 

[hicntry]

How inconvient do you think it is to find a good spot, turn your dogs out and 5 or 10 min. later find out someone elses dogs are all ready working the area. Boy, that really pisses me off

....trying to get all those wound up dogs under control so I can move on down the road with them. Damn Cinco, I guess life is just tough all over.LOL

 

[Shot]

letting your dog kill a wounded (insert animal species here) = unethical.

Last time I checked a "ethical" hunter always wants a clean and quick kill. I don't care what animal your hunting, you should respect it and finish it off asap. From the information I gathered from this post, these men deserve to get the max penlity, 1st because the broke the law, 2nd cause the gave us a bad name.

As far as dog hunters go, the only ones I have met are one of the most "ethical" people that I know. I asked my grandfather if any dog hunter every got in his way of hunting, and the answer was NO. For his 65 yrs of hunting experience that says two things, dog hunters are respectful and there aren't that many to being with (compared to non-dog hunters).

 

[prohunter]

I will throw one more out there. I heard some dogs on some animals once while I was hunting. They were coming up a steep brushy hill. I waited & waited to see what came up. Pretty soon about 3 deer ran by me. Right on there heels were some hounds with radio collars. now here is the question: if a buck ran up by me should I of shot it? What about a bear? I had both tags. I know nobody was coming up that steep canyon (people). I did run into the owners of the dogs later on trying to catch up with there dogs. I told him they went that way chasing some deer. He told me "not his dogs. They don't chase trash." What are your commets on this.

 

[Speckmisser]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

now here is the question: if a buck ran up by me should I of shot it? What about a bear? I had both tags.[/b]

It'd be purely up to you, but I wouldn't say it was wrong if you chose to shoot. If you're on public land, you have as much right to shoot game as anyone else, dogs or no dogs. You didn't ask them to run the dogs for you, and they didn't ask if you would mind. So it's even in my opinion.

Just depends on how you feel about taking a "lucky" deer rather than one you worked hard for. I can see how some folks would choose not to shoot, and I certainly respect that.

 

[prohunter]

I heard the story was in the Visalia Times Delta, but I was not able to find it.

 

[tony270]

Either why, if the finishing move is with a hound, point or firearm, they are dead. The only porblem is our State game law won't allow it.

 

[hicntry]

Prohunter, if it is a nice buck, shoot it. If it is a bear it can be touchy. Technically I would say it is their bear and I know many that have guide licenses and have paying customers. If they tree close to you, stay back and be quiet until the hunters get to their dogs. They may be more than happy to let you shoot it. Many of them are just working their dogs and something that many people don't realize is that "they won't use their tags because the season is over for them soon as they kill a bear". I hear people say that it isn't fair chase with a dog. Anyone that has hired a guide may as well have dogs. That guide, for all intent and purpose is your dog...just has less legs. That last bit was for Speck and his comment on taking a lucky one or one that you really worked hard for. 90% of the time, you more than earn anything you get with dogs. It is a grueling ordeal...especially if you have never done it. If the dogs tree a mile uphill or clear across a conyon, it is no leisurly stroll. It is hustle all the way because if the bear jumps the tree you may have another 5 miles to go. So look at it this way, your guide is out scouting and has located some great bull elk and I just happened to have been watching, would you be happy is I shot one of them before you got into position?

 

[Speckmisser]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

Anyone that has hired a guide may as well have dogs. That guide, for all intent and purpose is your dog...just has less legs. That last bit was for Speck and his comment on taking a lucky one or one that you really worked hard for.[/b]

I'm not quite getting your point, Hicntry. Or maybe you didn't get mine.

If you think I'm suggesting that hound hunting isn't working hard, you've read me wrong. I've done it. I know what's involved. And as I've said over and over, I don't knock the houndsmen one lick. It's not my game, but that doesn't mean I don't respect the tradition, effort, or investment the houndsmen put into their sport.

What I AM saying, is if you're standing there and somebody's hounds push a deer, hog or bear past you, then you've got a lucky opportunity. Some folks would turn it down, because they didn't do the work to get the shot. And some folks would smoke the critter and be happy to have it. For me, it's a decision I'd have to make the moment it happens.

I understand that the houndsman might not be too happy to have it play out that way, and I can see the point. But I figure it's fair enough, especially when the dogs come in and turn an area inside out in a matter of minutes that you may have spent days or even months scouting and patterning.

 

[Shot]

Wow, this thread has gone off topic. So were talking about guided hunts?

I guess everyone analyizes everybodies post to the last word or phrase.

hicntry,
You make some good points, but I have to say hunting with a guide and having a hunting dog is not the same thing. Its is true that both guide and dog do most of the work for you (hunting work that is) , but using a dog is much easier (in some respects). True, it is more physically demanded when your running after the dog to catch up to a bayed animal, but what part of hunting techniques have you used? (only dog hunting techniques) I see using a dog as using one animal's powers against another animal's (thats dog vs hog). You put a guide in an unfamiliar territory and along with anyone of us experienced hunters, and he has no advantage over us. On the other hand if one of us has a dog, our chances increase a lot. This is the reason I don't do guided hunts or use dogs, its just not my cup of tea.

Don't anyone get me wrong, dog hunting and guiding is no easy work, it just takes great work load of the hunter

.

 

[hicntry]

Guys, your right, there are a lot of differences between guides and dogs and hunters in general. Hunters hunt, mainly for the challenge and being out doors. My enjoyment of hunting is 95% watching dogs, that I have bred and raised, do outstanding dog work with a formidable foe. It is warching them take a track and work it out on circles, each bigger than the last, till they pick up the track again. Iot's watching the young dogs react to things when they are being roaded. How they do on their first hunt. Largely, hunting to me is a way to fully enjoy the dogs. It isn't the hunt for hunting sake. The hunter that does it on his own,,,,going out and scouting out an area, studying the movement of game, memorizing waterholes, game trails, and bedding areas is a true hunter.

 

[BobcatJess]

Well said Hicntry

 

[hicntry]

Shot, you said that when a dog is put into the equation, the odds are greatly increased. That is not exactly true. If it were, there would be no point, or enjoyment, in what many of us do with dogs. Your odds, most of the time, are only going to increase if the dog came from "one of us dogmen" and has been bred and worked to do what he does. Same is true with herding dogs, not just any dog will get results. Your skills are reading sign, movement and knowing your game. If you are good, you will be successful. Dogmens skills are knowing a good dog when they see it and how to work with it to bring it to a pinnacle of performance. If they are good at it...they will be successful. You spend your time scouting, we spend ours roading and training. Although the skills required are vastly different, both methods require skill and a lot of time to be successful.

 

[Shot]

hicntry,

I was not clear in my last statement. When I say dog, I mean a hunting dog trained for a specific species. I know that not just any dog will do, I have 3 dogs of my own and they are no where near improving my tracking or any other hunting related variables (they are family dogs). It is a given that a trained dog increases your chances of located game (animal vs. animal), thats why people us them, while a untrained dog will decrease your chance, for example barking while your stalking and getting in the way of a shot.

As to the rest of your statement, I agree with you 100%. However, I never said that being a dogman takes no skills, its a lot of hard work both on and off the field. What I meant by "hunting techniques" was stalking, tracking, etc. that a hunter usually does while a dogman relies on the dog. A dogman as a whole new set of techniques to master, I almost see it as a different sport. I hope that clears some stuff up. Don't get me wrong, I am not against it, in fact I have enjoyed running behind my friend's dogs many times, but the excitment for me of succesful out smarting an animal by myself is more rewarding.

 

[hicntry]

I understand what you are saying Shot. I am not being critical of the way you like to hunt and I have not taken anything you have said as being critical. I am explaining, more for others, new to the sport, that there is, in my mind anyway, a big difference between a hunter and a dogman that hunts with dogs.

Heck, I am not even sure How I digressed to this point on this thread. I think it is Speck's fault.

 

[Shot]

hicntry

Thats good what your doing (informing people). Most people don't know much about it and with the heat that dog hunters have been getting lately, they need all the support they can get.