FHL hogs and "the process"

[JungleBoy]

I've hunted FHL for 5 years, but no longer hunt there. The following, as long and as boring as it is, IS my experience hunting at FHL.
It is beautiful country, but the hunting is over-rated. MOST EXCELLENT habitat, but WAY too many hunters...

The NUMBER ONE reason I don't go there anymore, is the hassle of having to check-in.... check-out....register.... I have also had my share of bad experiences with other apparently anti-hunting FHL personel, and mistreatments by them. Can't enter an area (to start walking/hiking) earlier than an hour before sunrise, can't leave an area later than an hour after sunset (a REAL problem if you have gotten game at the last light....). Also, I don't care for the long lines, crowds, area assignments, and the hassle of changing them, etc.... Lets face it.... I go hunting to have fun, and get away from the everyday hussle.... At FHL, I find more of the same!

Now, the success rates..... If you get drawn for Elk, it is pretty much a sure bet. Quail and rabbits can be found in decent abundance as well. But, as far as deer and hogs go, IMO you are MUCH better off somewhere else. I know that someone might jump out and say "BUT YOU ALWAYS SEE A COUPLE OF HOGS TAKEN EVERY WEEKEND!". True.... you also have to consider the number of people who hunted there in an attempt to take a hog. The weekends that I've been there, LOTS of hunters, and a couple of hogs.... making the probability very close to public land elsewhere. I assure you, if 100 guys went in all directions on a nearby forest land, a couple of them WOULD score hogs. As for deer, at least in my experience, the same thing.... The openning day (which I only went ONCE!) is like a frik'n ZOO!!! HUNDREDS of hunters in line before the morning.... from my understanding, some go there couple of days early to stand in line (or so I was told).... Looks like the bread line in a communist country!!!! By midday of that openning morning, I believe there were 7 or 8 bucks taken.... NONE impressive, and all barely legal!!! In my opinion, one can do A LOT better on public land!!!

There are more reasons that I don't hunt there anymore. I can get rabbits and quail with sufficient abundance locally. I havn't hunted deer in a while, but see them (bucks and does) regularly on public lands, to where if I decided to start hunting them, I'd feel that I'd have a fairly decent chance at legal bucks. In general, I hunt a lot of upland and small game relatively locally. Sometimes I get them, sometimes I don't. It's always fun, with little driving, and NO CHECK-IN/OUT hassle, no vouchers needed, no annual pass needed, etc.

My biggest passion is Hog hunting.... I, too, have hiked probably hundreds of miles, and many many weekends all over public lands, and have put in my time. If you have a public land hot spot, more power to you. All my successful public land hog hunts (and there weren't many!) was a result of being at the right place, at the right time..... Lucky for me, VERY unlucky for the pig. However, in ALL cases, they were 'transients'.

The main reason that I started hunting FHL was because of it's suppozed 'good hog hunting'. That is just about the only reason that I started hunting there, as I could get everything else, everywhere else, without the hassles or attitudes. But that is WAY over-rated, and simply NOT ture. I hunt all my other game on public land, away from the crowds, etc, and of course, I take slugs or a rifle or whatever, IN-CASE I accidentaly run into a hog...

However, when I WANT to go hog hunting, I go with a guided hunt.... sure.... $400 sounds like quite a bit, BUT, it's not. After all, why pay $400 when there is GOOD hog hunting at FHL? Well....

Lets look at the economy of my hunting FHL for hogs for 4 or 5 years.... I believe MOST will attest to similar success rates (at least 3 other I know are in the same boat).
The first year, I went about 5 times... did not have an annual....the price was about $29 with the add-on fees, per weekend. So, it was $145 for the first year. Then, for the next 4 years, I had annual permits... $70 per year, so that's $280.... So far, we have $280+145=$425 JUST for permits.... I went there an average of 7 or 8 times per year. So, I went there about 38 (sounds about right) times or so.....It's about 450 miles, round trip (including the driving around at FHL) from my place. My truck gives me about 16 mpg, so it's 28 gallons used each time. That is more than 1100 gallons that I've used up going there. I would often meet up with buddies up there, but rarely share a ride with them, so 99% of the time, I pay 100% of the gas money. I would estimate that the average fuel cost over the last few years is about $1.35 per gallon (I'm being conservative), so that's about $1485 for fuel to FHL over the years, bringing the grand total to $1900+ for fuel and permits ONLY. Now, I could go on and on about food/overnight accomodations, etc, etc.... but I won't because I did not have to stay at the Hacienda as often as I did, and I did not have to EAT as much as I did.... on average, the food/accomodation bill was about $70-150 per weekend, depending on where we stayed, what we ate, etc, and that runs into the thousands over they years, but we will leave that out.... So.... $1920 for 5 years, and no hogs.... That is FIVE quality private ranch guided pig hunts, and FIVE pigs that COULD have been in my freezer, just in permits and fuel.... So I did pay for a hog per year.... but got none..... Don't get me wrong. I still enjoy hunting for pigs (while hunting for other things) on public lands, I enjoy the experience, the hike, the scenary (and none of the hassles of FHL).... but I NO LONGER fool myself into thinking that it is less costly to hunt for pigs on public land.... ESPECIALLY FHL.

Just my opinion......

 

[Bill in SD]

Jungleboy, you are right about the costs. I have been going to FHL a few times a year for about a couple of years. The habitat is excellent and there are lots of pigs and deer and other wildlife there.

There are lots of hunters too, as well as the hassles.

Yep, it would be cheaper and easier in the long run for me who lives in San Diego to go on one guided hunt per year, than go to FHL many times per year if my sole goal was to score on a pig.

The real difference you said is that you could hunt at FHL for 8 times per year versus once at a private ranch. That private ranch is over 8 times more expensive than going to FHL!!!! Is it 8 times better? Well maybe, you have 8 times better chance or even more of scoring a pig.

However, what if you would like to hunt pigs several times a year?

I guess to me, being able to get out and hunt several times a year is more important than going once and scoring.

I have had a really good time at FHL each time I have gone, even though I have only seen pigs once in about 5 or so trips. The whole experience is great. And I can hunt other game when I am there.

I also think that each time I have gone, I have gotten to know my way around more and have a better chance at scoring.

There are local guys that are doing very well at FHL for pigs.

The reality for me is that it is too long to go there several times a month.

I already bought a year pass for FHL for my wife and me and plan to hunt there a few times this year.

Right now I am not ready to shell over the bucks for a private pig hunt. I guess I am too cheap and too stuborn. It is really an individual thing. To me the cost of a private hunt exceeds the value of killing a pig. I am sure there are guys that would pay a grand or more to hunt pigs on a ranch for a weekend, but not me. And I have already killed a pig with a bow as well as a Javalina.

Jungleboy, thanks for detailing out the costs. I have done that myself and come to the same conclusions as you. Maybe I am not very hard core about hog hunting. I eagerly shell out hundreds of dollars for just an elk tag, however to me, I really, truely enjoy hunting elk and mule deer much more than pigs.

Another thing is that the more times I hunt FHL for pigs the more determined I am about going back and not giving up.

I may or may not go on a private ranch in the future. I think if it was on a ranch with the possibilty of shooting a big boar, I would be more inclined. And if there weren't trophy fees.

Anyway the jury is still out.
Thanks
Bill

 

[JungleBoy]

You said that you can afford to hunt 8 times more than on private....

Not true! I STILL do 99% of my hunting on public land, on BLM and national forests. Lots of GOOD areas to explore, and hunt, without the long drive and the hassles. I sometime go out for a quick 3 or 4 hour rabbit/quail hunt, other times, do overnighters (camping experience) and hunt for small game, etc..... But ALWAYS, I have pig tags, and a weapon that is legal/capable of taking pigs. So you see, I don't hunt ONLY private land.... on the contrary, I hunt 99% public, and will get out every opportunity that I get. This way, I enjoy a LOT of hunting (free) without the drive or the hassles....

But when I want a good chance at a wild pig, I go private.... way cheaper.... I am familiar with a few of the known good areas of FHL for pigs as well. Area 29 used to be one of my favorite. I ALWAYS saw fresh signs.... But, that too is really a hit or miss. You get up early, hike to the farthest depths of the area with lots of signs, set up, and sit quietly..... only to have a dozen hunters leisurly walking in, making noise, SHOOTING!!!, eating, spitting, laughing walk by your setup (not even knowing that you are there). In one instance, a "too-ambitious" duck hunter going "waa waa waa".... "waa waa waa...." "waa waa waa" EVERY 10 SECONDS, ALL FREAK'N DAY LONG! I felt like walking up to him, grabbing his duck call, and stomping on it!!! (of course, I didn't!).

And, in the non-primitive-weapon areas.... you have a lot of guys wearing cammo, riding in the back of their 4X4 pickups, off-roading, making a lot of noise, trying to 'find game'.... As if the game will not see them, since they are wearing cammo.....


The figures that I gave, believe me, were VERY conservative. In ALL HONESTY, after the dust settles after each and every FHL trip, I will have spent an average of $200 per trip. So..... the next time I have the "urge" to go and try my luck at FHL, I can "skip" that trip.... The following time that I have the urge, I can go to a private ranch, with the money I saved from the skipped trip, and this one. Also, if you go private, since you are up there, do some forest land public hunting there as well! Either the day before, or after your private land hunt!

 

[MrMullen]

I have not hunted before and I am still in the "wanna be" group but I think your hunting costs are too high.
The permits are fixed cost; they are what they are and you can't change them, but it seems your spending too much on gas, room and food.
You may be stuck with the 16 mpg truck, but you should find someone who has a car that gets better MPG. Just doubling the MPG of your transport will cut that fuel bill in half, which appears to be a lot.

I know this is a pointless post that points out the obvious, but my jaw dropped when you said you were driving to FHL from San Diego with a 16 MPG truck.

Hey, I also live in San Diego, maybe we can split transport fees to FHL sometime. What I might do is borrow my parents fith wheel in Feburary and go camping up there. It has all the stuff that make modern day camping actually fun, enjoyable and cheap. Anyone in San Diego or on the way to FHL is welcome to catch a ride, as long as they split gas costs!

 

[BLASTMASTER]

Wow...I just wanted to know the process in case I decide in the future to try it.

 

[JungleBoy]

Actually, I do not travel from Sandy-Eggo !!! I live in the LA area, so the 450 miles round trip is from there.....

The reason that I often drive up alone is that my hunting buddies either live in Burbank/Glendale area (they take hwy 5), or come down from San Jose, whereas I take the 101. In any case though, I like the freedom of knowing that I can cut the trip short, or spend an extra day, or change my plans on the fly....


Also, as for the permit fees.... Even if you get annuals, year, AND split the cost of fuel, with travel costs, food, etc, I'd still bet that a handfull of fruitless hog hunts at FHL equal in cost to a private ranch hunt.

As far as my figures go.... believe me, I have been conservative. I may have calculated the gas realistically, but I did not include a lot of the misc. stuff. Hauling a trailer behind your truck WILL give you a worse milage... Even then, you have to pay $5 per night camping fees....

It's all in the overall value.... For example, lets say that you leave on a Friday to hunt FHL. You spend half the day driving to get there... but you can't hunt FHL on Fridays.... so you setup camp, etc, kill time..... You can not camp in any of the TA's, and can NOT start your entry/hike into the areas earlier than half hour before legal shooting times.....
You also have half a days worth of driving ahead of you to get home, that makes it about a full days worth of driving (about 9 hours), and being hassled..... and..... what for?

I can hunt everything else (that I care to hunt) within a 2 hour or so radius..... I can get there Friday, and START hunting on Friday.... and no fees, etc. Of course, the chances of my running into a pig are very slim.... However, as I mentioned, if I decided that I REALLY want a pig in the freezer, for the cost of 2 (maybe 3, heck, lets say 4!!!) non-productive-hassle-some FHL pig excursions, I can go on a quality hunt!

I love hunting public land.... free, beautiful, and reasonable amount of game (not too different from FHL), no lines, no registeration, no hassles, no attitude, and often, quite close by.

I love private ranch hunting (hogs, strictly) for obvious reasons....

I don't like FHL, because you pay ( a little at a time, but you pay!), too many rules, too much hassle, too much driving, too many hunters/crowds.... and not enough game to justify it.

 

[Bill in SD]

Jungle Boy, what I meant is that by your calculations the price of 8 hunting trips at FHL is the same price as one guided hunt.

Actually, you still have to pay for gas and other stuff for the one guided hunt, but not for 8 trips you would make to FHL.

I agree with your costs, however you could consider that for wear, tear, and maintanence on your truck the true cost is about $0.20 per mile. Jungle Boy that would increase your total by $1,935 for a grand total of $3,855 for 38 trips or $101 per trip. (how many of us really believe our transportation costs are JUST the price we pay for gas!!!).

Then you would figure that one guided trip would be $400 plus 450 miles times $0.20 per mile = $90 or a total of about $500 for a guided trip. I think most guided hunts are around $500 so the the total would be a little over $600.

And even with that comparison, FHL is still vastly cheaper to hunt than a guided hunt. Compare $101 with $600. I am talking price to hunt. If you measure your hunts by kills then of course the guided hunt makes a lot of more sense. And it is much cheaper to hunt one time on a guided hunt and kill a pig, than to hunt many, many times at FHL, maybe an infinite number and still not kill a pig.

MrMullen I tend to agree with Jungle Boys cost estimate, in fact I think it is much lower than reality. Yep, if you carpooled you could cut the transportation part in half. I drive up with my wife. Man I have a little Nissan 4x4 6 cylinder and it gets about 17 mpg at the most. You really need a truck to hunt FHL unless you hunt the primative walk in areas.

Jungle Boy, I live in San Diego and the closest place of I know of to hunt pigs on public land is FHL. I do spend lots of time on public land in the San Diego area, however the hunting is spotty at best. I do enjoy the time spent outdoors.

Anyway, you are happy with the private hunts and that is greatl.

I am not really happy with either FHL or the prospect of a guided hunt.

Happy Trails. I am off on a cow elk hunt in Utah for 9 days.
Bill

 

[DILPRXO]

I still love to public land hunt....Some of my fondest memories are of Stockdale Mountain years ago when you could hunt it with out getting on a warden's hit list.... But once was enough at FHL...people tryin to hunt quail in mass....the weekend warriors in camo 4x4's running around everywhere....reservation counter said I was 1 minute early and would have to call back....the speeding ticket I recieved from an M.P when I know I wasn't speeding..I saw him parked..who speeds in front of the cops..(I really like how they give you an envelope with the ticket so you can just pay..they know you don't want to drive the hours back to fight it).. only redeaming feature was I liked the history of the mission there...hunted Camp Roberts once.. very cool hunt... but no mas at FHL for me.

 

[spectr17]

FHL for me is a fun time except for the check in window abuse. ALmost 5 hur ride in my 13 MPG Blazer. Splitting the campground or billetting fees helps. I hit FHL once or twice for spring turkey and hogs, a few times in the fall for quail, yotes, hogs and turkey.

I don't deer hunt there cuz it's too darn hot in August. Too many rattlers then too it seems.

Pigs, I see them maybe one out of 5 or 6 trips maybe to FHL. As Jungle boy said, it's more luck than anything else since you can't prescout Friday before the weekend. You pick a known good pig area and hope they are there that morning. If not I switch off to quail or coyotes etc. I used to have decent access to pig hunting in SoCal but lost one place and now just have one local spot that is a crap shoot too. And no, I won't tell where that is, sorry. It's the reason I started to hunt Tejon, better odds and closer for pig. Public pig hunting is tough sledding.

Turkey spots are well know and crowded. There are two long time inner circle bozos who ride mountain bikes into one turkey area every year and literally stalk and flush the birds all day long and make them spooky as heck. After one of them busted our setup I asked them if they knew how dangerous it was to be sneaking around the hillsides in turkey season. He claimed the birds couldn't be called in. Well yeah, after you flush them 5 times before 10 am they tend to be that way. This was the same guy who busted our setup as we reeled in 3 jakes, 2 hens and a huge gobbler by CALLING them in. He shot one of our birds and thankfully I saw him in time so we didn't shoot him by accident since he was right next to the tom we were talking to. I offered to teach them how to call a turkey in or have my buddy Jimmy, who is a pro staffer, teach them but they refused. My suggestion is wait these fools out. Most of them give up by 11am and leave and then you can possibly talk to a bird if they haven't been flushed to many times already. That or scout out new areas that no one is in. I did that this spring and found a tom only to have some picnickers who aren't even supposed to be in the the hunt areas spook the bird off. Scout and you will find birds there.

Bobcats and yotes are thick. Seeing a bobcat here is a rare deal, up there you can see 5 or more in one day. Badgers are also there if you want to wrassle one of them.

Quail are usually thick but this year they seem to be down a bit.

Never dove hunted there, always in SoCal.

I've watched duck hunters do good on some of the reserviors and in some flooded low spots. One year I almost put the quail shotgun up after watching mallards dive bomb this one spot by the Naciamento River all morning.

Watching the elk is fun.

Like Jungleboy, I do most of my rabbit, dove etc. hunting in the local SBNF which is 20 minutes for me. BLM land is also 20 minutes. All free, well except for the Adventure Pass for the NF.

 

[Kickaha]

Comparing FHL to a guided hunt isn’t valid for me. Although the word “hunt” is used in each, they’re really not the same thing.

Although I’ve never hunted with a guide, everything I’ve read about guided hog hunts in California would seem to indicate that getting a pig on a guided hunt is all but a sure thing. Assuming you’re in half-way decent shape and can occasionally hit a 5” target at 50 yards, you’re going home with a pig.

But hunting at FHL is more like hunting on public land. If you want a pig, you’re going to have to get out and work for it. If you drive around in your truck all day, you’ll be disappointed. You have to get out, walk around, search for sign, try to figure out their habits, etc. You have to HUNT for them. I probably walked about 20 miles during my last trip up to FHL. As a result, I now have a much better idea of where the pigs are hiding. I plan on making a lot more trips this season (I’ve been up there three times so far). By the time June roles around, I expect to not only have a pig or two, but to have several of the training areas fully mapped out. With any luck, I’ll have the suckers nailed by this time next year.

Now the bad parts.

You are correct about the costs. By June I will have spent far more money than if I had just gone on a guided hunt. If it’s a simple matter of economics, a guided hunt will win hands down every time. Well, maybe the PORs are more cost effective for someone familiar with Tejon Ranch. But it’s not (for me) simply about costs. It’s about hunting for the pigs. And while you can hunt on more public land, I’d like to know that there’s at least a small chance of success each time I go out. Last trip to FHL, I went by William’s Hill above Lockwood on the way home. I’ve heard several sources say there are pigs up there. Well, there may be pigs up there, but they won’t be taken by me. It’s very hilly, very steep, and very brushy country. Now a REAL hunter might love that. I’ll stick to FHL.

When up there, I’ll either camp or stay in King City. I used to stay at the Hacienda, but what you pay for what you get is such a bad deal, I can’t do it anymore. You get a much nicer room for much less in King City. The price for that is a half hour drive one way.

I’m also annoyed by the 1 hour before/after sunrise/sunset rule. The sunset rule especially makes it difficult to go very far from your truck with any hope of getting out of the training area in time.

And then there are the sheer number of hunters. They allow WAY too many in a single area. Besides the ones going barreling down the road scaring anything that moves, you also have the ones that engage in unethical/illegal behavior. I’ve seen hunters hunting right next to paved roads. One time, while walking on this dirt road on top of a ridge with sage brush on both sides, I came to a clearing. Down on one side was a hunter pointing his rifle at me (until he realized I wasn’t a pig). That’s bad enough, but he also did not have a clear view of what was behind me. He didn’t know where his bullet would end up if he missed. And then there was another time…. Anyway, there are absolutely too many hunters. I’m hoping that it will clear up a bit after most of the bird seasons are over. If it doesn’t, this is the one area that might keep me away from FHL.

I’ve never had a problem with checking in, checking out, or registering. I’ll usually hunt the same area for a whole weekend unless it’s really crowded. Each training area is big enough that you don’t really have to leave. If you’re hunting on foot, you can’t possibly see 1/10th of a single area in a weekend. And if you’re just driving around, you’re not going to get anything anyway. I’ve had more problems going with other people who have different schedules than anything else. Now THAT’S a pain.

The drive up is 5 hours one way for me. The nearest halfway decent public land area is 3.5 hours. The extra 90 minutes is worth it for me. If I stay all weekend, I don’t mind an extra 3 hours (total) for a better quality weekend.

When FHL is closed or the open training areas limited, I’ll usually go out searching for decent public land. While driving around Pozo with my brother, we were joking that you didn’t really need signs to tell you whether you were on public land or not. If it looked like a halfway decent pig-friendly area, it was private. If it looked like a pig wasn’t within 1000 miles, it was public. This never failed. So while I might eventually find some decent public land south of FHL, I haven’t yet. But every time I’m out, I do usually drive past areas that I make note of so I can come back another day and take a closer look.

Anyway, to each his own. I understand your frustrations. They just don’t bother me as much. I might try one of the Tejon PORs in 2003, but haven’t decided yet.

 

[JungleBoy]

Kickaha: Believe me I am not afraid of doing a lot of foot work. I have done a lot of it ... I have covered a lot of what is considered 'productive' areas of FHL (as well as MANY other public lands from Ventura to Monterey) on foot.
I have been to just about every square inch of areas 29, and 30 (walk in only), and covered a LOT of other areas, including 10/13, 25, 7, EVEN area 3, which used to be archery only.... hopeing to find the 'honey hole'. One may exist..... but I believe that even then, it is a transient and a temporary situation, and will not exist for long. Like I tell my friend (and as you mentioned about Pozo):

"If you were a pig, would you want to live/eat/sleep there (pointing at the green Vineyard, rolling hills,nice cover, and a nice watering hole on the private land to the left", or there? (pointing to the God forsaken, dry, brushy, , void of water public land to the right)....... I know what I would do if I were a pig!

I do not mean to discourage anyone... maybe it was our luck, but the first time that I went to FHL, I loved it.... I thought that we are on to something, and that we will have our public land pig real soon. After about 7 or 8 trips, I had a pretty good idea of the lay of the land of some of my favorite areas, and seeing someone with a hog at the cleaning station motivated me even more. At that time, I thought that the knowledge of the areas, and the fresh sign, etc would soon translate into an FHL pig. Afterall, in theory, we were finding fresh rooting, scat, pig hair, and 'text book' paw-prints.
Heck, a couple of years ago, in December, a portion of one of the areas looked like it was BULLDOZED an hour ago!!! However, the truth is that most of the 'signs' (at least in our case) were being left at night time, when they are most active there and that they are long gone by first light.

What I found MOST interesting and disappointing at the same time, which is also against my philosophy of hunting, and my way of doing things, was that MOST whom had success at FHL for pigs, did so out of PURE LUCK.
At least the ones that I talked to, always said things indicating something like "the pig ran accross the dirt trail as we were driving....", or a pig basically being at the wrong place, and at the wrong time (which is also how I harvested my public land pig). Other times (at least 2 times) you will have someone whom was on their FIRST hog hunt, and do not quite realize how LUCKY they were to get a hog..... and they think that there is nothing to this 'public land' hog hunting. In one of these cases, this kid (no older than 16 or 17) and his friend had shot the mama sow (120+ lbs, decent not very huge), and her 2 little pigletts. And I MEAN pigglets. As in smaller than a Chihuahua pigletts. That was their first time pig hunting. He was bragging, and going on and on about how he used his 'hunting knowlege', bla bla bla...(of course, his friend had told my buddy that one of the piglets had ran accross the dirt trail, and hid under a bush, which is where they found the other piglett and the mama). What was REALLY SAD, was that he had used a 7mm mag for all of them. The pigletts were shot mid-body, and the two halves of them were barely connected by skin. Each had less edible meat left on them than a chicken wing. He went on and on about how his 7mm mag just ANCHORED them....

For those in San Diego, there are decent amounts of public land that are somewhat close by, which do hold quite a bit of game (rabbit, deer, birds, etc, but no pig).

That said, and back to the subject of private ranch hunts.... There are some good ones, and some not so good ones (personal preferrance). I went on one of the ranches that has pigs, and did not care for the operation. The terrain was steep and not too easy to traverse, but the game was not wild, and not enough of a challenge. Needless to say, I decided against taking any animals there. On the other hand, some of the better operations with a guide (and let him know what you want) do nothing more than giving you access to prime pig country, where YOU and the guide must use your hunting know-how, etc to find, and stalk the game, but the game is free-roaming and wild, and the ranches are SEVERAL TENS of THOUSANDS of acres (or at least several thousand acres) big.

Believe it or not, (this probably being the BEST piece of advice I can give) is that one can learn A LOT by hunting with a guide. A good guide KNOWS how to find them, and if you pay attention, it WILL make you a better hunter....

All this pig talk is bringing back LOTS and LOTS of memories (and making me hungry at the same time)...... I'll share some of them with you guys..... as soon as I organize my thoughts.....

 

[Two Rugers]

I quit going FHL 12 years ago after the 2nd time some broke into my truck.
My sister who was in the Air Force did get me into the Base near Santa Barbara. Woo hoo it was PIG Heaven there. Too bad she got out.