Hunting from a Boat

[Surfswest]

Amazingly, few people know that here in california, it is LEGAL to discharge a firearm from a boatfor the purposes of hunting. While looking the regs over last year I found this:

§251. Prohibition on Pursuing or Shooting Birds and Mammals from Motor-Driven Air or Land Vehicles, Motorboats, Airboats, Sailboats or Snowmobiles.

(a) General Prohibition: No person shall pursue, drive, herd, or take any bird or mammal from any type of motor-driven air or land vehicles, motorboat, airboat, sailboat, or snowmobile. Additionally, no person shall use any motorized, hot-air, or unpowered aircraft or other device capable of flight or any earth orbiting imaging device to locate or assist in locating big game mammals beginning 48 hours before and continuing until 48 hours after any big game hunting season in the same area. No person shall use at any time or place, without Department approval, any computer, telemetry device or other equipment to locate a big game mammal to which a tracking device is attached. For purposes of this subsection "use" includes but is not limited to personal use or intent by another to obtain information from such personal use. Evidence of an act constituting a violation of this section includes but is not limited to flying slowly at low altitudes, hovering, circling or repeatedly flying over any area where big game may be found. Exceptions to this subsection are:

(1) When the motor of such motorboat, airboat, or sailboat has been shut off and/or the sails furled and its progress therefrom has ceased, and it is drifting, beached, moored, resting at anchor, or is being propelled by paddle, oar or pole.


I spoke with DFG officials numerous times this last year and they all gave me the same answer: They didn't know!!! But they would always go back to their offices, make a couple calls, and call me back and say that it is legal, but just make sure that I am carrying with me a copy of the regs as well as notify any sherriff or other official at the lake or river that I was going to ahead of time so they are aware of what I will be doing.

Has anybody else in California come across this situation and what has been the outcome??

Frosty

 

[Kentuck]

Might be best to ask this question over in the Waterfowl Forum. Tons of duck hunters hunt out of boats. Only thing here in CA to watch for is the High Water mark and issues involving temporarily flooded lands. Gets sticky there.

 

[Speckmisser]

Shooting from a powerboat gets sticky anyway, although I don't know if there's a ton of room for misinterpretation. Fish and Game Code 3002 specifically prohibits shooting at birds or mammals from a powerboat, but says nothing about canoes, kayaks, or rowboats.

Then again, there's section 251 that says as long as you're not under power (or sail).

I used to drift the rivers and creeks back east for ducks, deer and squirrels, and I could see using the same tactic out here... especially for hogs. Still gotta watch those property lines. It's gotta be "navigable" water, and stay above mean high water, or you're tresspassing. CA has some odd interpretations of "navigable" waterways too... so err on the side of caution.

 

[BirdDawg]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

Shooting from a powerboat gets sticky anyway, although I don't know if there's a ton of room for misinterpretation[/b]

What part of this did you not understand speck?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

Exceptions to this subsection are:

(1) When the motor of such motorboat, airboat, or sailboat has been shut off and/or the sails furled and its progress therefrom has ceased, and it is drifting, beached, moored, resting at anchor, or is being propelled by paddle, oar or pole.[/b]

The biggest problem I can see here is this......say your out fishing and carrying your rifle just in case you want to hunt and you see a big ol buck swimmin the lake........so you just follow him to the bank......shut off the motor........wait till the boat stops moving......as the buck emerges from the water you put your crosshairs on it......the buck runs 30 feet up the bank, stops and turns broad side........*BANG*......the deer is down..................meanwhile the game warden is sitting up on the road watching the whole show......what do you suppose he is going to site you for?
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Herding deer with your boat.......you weren't herding it you were following it......LOL....but the warden see's it different.........now your without a boat,rifle and have a big ol fine to try to get out of.

I just remembered this was the hog forum......guess hogs can swim too.

 

[Speckmisser]

As I said, BD... not much room for misinterpretation. I understand it all quite well... well enough, in fact to agree that exactly the scenario you described is why it gets "sticky". The way you see your actions and the way they're perceived by law enforcement can be VERY different.

If you're in a powerboat and you decide to kill something, you better make dang sure you're completely in the clear, legally, before you do it.

The exclusion mentioned in section 251 (originally posted by Surfswest) is NOT included in the Fish and Game Codes if you look them up by statute.

 

[Kentuck]

I've hunted from a boat for ducks many a time. As long as the boat is not under power and any movement from the "power" has ceased it is legal to hunt from a boat. Again, the only issues I have seen or heard brought up is the interpretation of Navigable Waters. Most arguments stem from duck hunting the by-passes when they flood. There are court cases on this and the CWA, I believe, can get you the information you would like on these cases.

 

[camo snob]

Say you do shoot the deer/hog and he is laying on the bank. Is this GMA/WMA land or your land? cause if it is someone else's land you would be trespassing. It is required by law that all ducks MUST be retrieved, and if you are hunting navigable water you have to get your duck. In SC you cannot carry your firearm when retrieving said duck, on someone else's property. It would look bad if a warden saw you shoot a deer/hog/any big game from a boat like previously stated and you would probably have to fight your battle in a court room. I would not shoot big game animals out of a boat.

If you do, best of luck.

 

[Kentuck]

Camo snob brings up a good point. Make sure it is public land before you shoot. If not, you will be in big trouble. You have to check also that the lake or river you are hunting allows such activity too. Most don't.

 

[PIGIG]

if the BGA layed on shore close enough to throw a rope around cound you not drag it back into the boat?? if you are not touching the land is it tresspassing

 

[Franklin3]

Every case on it's own merit.
As a general rule the public waterway extends to the "High Water Level"
anything laying on the bank between the center of the flow and it's "High Water Level" is on public land.

 

[Backcountry]

What if you were in a boat and your buddy radio'd you that he "saw a pig behind that bush right there and you should get ready because the porker is about to stick his snout out so you should shoot it"... would that be ok?

(gratuitous quarterly "we haven't had a radio thread" in a while shout-out to Speckmisser)

 

[Live2hunt]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

As a general rule the public waterway extends to the "High Water Level"
anything laying on the bank between the center of the flow and it's "High Water Level" is on public land.[/b]

That was my theory all along. I often take my boat on the Sacramento River fishing. I usually park the boat on a sandy beach and fish from the bank. The High Water Level was about 20-30 yards from the current water level. One time I had a landowner came running at me and told me to packup and leave because I was on his property. He said his property line is up to the whatever the current water level is. Not knowing the exact law on public waterway boundaries and didn't want to engage anything with a pissed landowner, I packed up and rode a few more miles up river to another spot.



L2H

 

[CaliDuckPro]

i've hunted out of a boat a few times. I just pull the motor up out of the water, to ensure any viewing wardens that the boat is not under power.

 

[Speckmisser]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

Not knowing the exact law on public waterway boundaries and didn't want to engage anything with a pissed landowner, I packed up and rode a few more miles up river to another spot.[/b]

Even though you were in the right, L2H, you still did the right thing. There's almost never any constructive end to having it out with a landowner over a hunting or fishing spot when there are spots just as good a little ways off.

If the issue really is worth a fight (such as a landowner blocking a public right of way), then come back with law enforcement and let them settle it.

Hey, Backcountry... what channel are you on? I didn't hear a thing, and that pig just slipped right on past me.

 

[ducslayer]

live2hunt I ran into the same thing years ago dove hunting on the Feather river some guy said he owned the sand bar and to get off, we told him where he could go.He came back with the Sheriff who backed him up saying the guy owned the property to the water. I allways wondered if the Sheriff was right or just a friend of his? :hittin-self:We boated up river to another sand bar ...duc

 

[Surfswest]

That sounds great guys. So let me just say a few more things. First off, this is a pig and hog thread, but thanks for the waterfowl comments. Some day if I get bored I might go shoot some ducks, but till then...........

Secondly, as Franklin3 said, every case on its own merit. But the reason I brought this up was due to a friend of mine. During deer hunt season he was out fishing lake mead on the far side of the lake. As he rounded a bend there was a beautiful 6 point buck staring there at him. Long story short, he was probably 20 yards or less for about a minute before it spooked and ran off, more than enough time to bag it, if he had his rifle with him.

Since this is a pig thread I'll get back on topic. If I were to round a bend in a boat, see pigs, kill the motor and flip it up just to be safe (thanks for the good advice CaliDuckPro), and shoot the pig on public land, I guess its legal. This sounds like a good plan to me.

Guess its time to get my license and tags again and convince my friend with the boat to head back out to our lake. Last talking with the game warden around lake pyramid, some pig signs have been seen, but no visual on a pig yet. Hopefully they will continue to spread and become plentiful West of the 5 Freeway.

Anyway, I have rambled enough here.

Frosty

 

[Farallon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Franklin3 @ Jul 26 2006, 05:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Every case on it's own merit.
As a general rule the public waterway extends to the "High Water Level"
anything laying on the bank between the center of the flow and it's "High Water Level" is on public land.[/b]

It is not "High Water Level" but High Tide. If the land is under Bureau of Reclamation management, high tide doesn't guarantee access. If the local BOR Manager doesn't want people on the bank, they have the authority to post the land.

I sort of like the "High Water Level" thinking. If you go back far enough, there have been at least two occasions in the 1800s, when the central valley was flooded; that would make all of the central valley open. I think it was 1964 when the Eel River Flooded, high water mark is about 20 feet above Highway 101, that would sure open up a lot of land under the "High Water Level" "rule".

Regarding the sand bar, if the land was developed by the BOR or is managed by the BOR, the landowner owns half of the sand bar (island), the land owner on the other side of the river owns the other half of the sand bar (island).

 

[Franklin3]

Just driving through the central valley you can see the line of the ancient sea floor. Maybe we try that?
For the next few weeks everyone just go hunt wherever you want see what happens?

 

[Speckmisser]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

I sort of like the "High Water Level" thinking. If you go back far enough, there have been at least two occasions in the 1800s, when the central valley was flooded; that would make all of the central valley open. I think it was 1964 when the Eel River Flooded, high water mark is about 20 feet above Highway 101, that would sure open up a lot of land under the "High Water Level" "rule".[/b]

Just to keep folks honest, the rule is Mean high tide, not simply high water. If you go hunting the floodwater line, you're gonna have a problem.

 

[Kentuck]

Go read this thread. It's from a duck hunting forum and long. The reason I mentioned duck hunting is these guys deal with this issue more than anyone and have the facts. Some even carry paper copies of court cases and the law to show not only the land owner but any LE officers that may arrive. It has more to do with flooded lands but there are some tidbits that pertain to "High Water" mark.

http://www.refugeforums.com/refuge/showthr...vigatable+Water