Tule Cow Elk hunt near Big Pine Ca. problems

[spectr17]

Letter to Western Outdoor News regarding the Tule Cow Elk hunt near Big Pine Ca.

5/17/02

I live in Sun Valley and am a 60 year-old carpenter, born in 1942 and served in the Army from 1960 to 1963. 1 have never written to a public official in my life but I need to get this bad taste of government out of my mouth. Every time I read the news or watch the TV it looks like someone in America is losing the freedoms that so many people have tried to preserve, and on top of that the people elected or appointed don't give a hoot what the people want or think.

I was told [by DFG wardens] that the DFG knew there was a problem with the current elk system in the Big Pine area and that it would be resolved. I have waited to get the DFG hunting and regulations news for 2002.

Well, it finally came. I should have known that what I was told in Big Pine by the DFG representatives was just a lot of B.S. In the new regulations there is not one mention of listening to the people. It's going to be the same old business. Big brother knows best.

The following is a letter I will be sending to the DFG and others.

To the California Department of Fish and Game:

Dear Sirs:

       I did not get drawn but my hunting partner did get a cow tag. We have hunted deer, quail and dove in this area so we felt a few days of scouting would be enough. We arrived on Nov. 14 and stayed until the last day of the season, Nov. 25.

Nov, 14th, 15th and 16th we scouted the area every day, all day, only seeing bulls in our area. All the cows were on the west side of Highway 395, which is out of the area we were allowed to hunt. On Friday, Nov. 16, we attended a mandatory orientation for all hunters in Independence. This was a very well organized and informative evening. The
wardens were very good and it moved along well. A taxidermist and butcher were there to advise on how to care for and preserve your game.

       Opening morning, we were out early, getting onto a group of elk, 12 in number, but they were all bulls. My partner having a cow tag, could just chase and then watch. This was what happened everyday for the whole season. Ten tags given out, 10 people chasing, the same elk and only 12 elk, all bulls, to look at on the east of the highway. On the west side of the highway, we could see about 125 cows and 21 bulls every day. There were 4 bull tags given out for this area. I saw 3 bulls taken.

The first three days were exciting but after that, it was really a waste of time. We even had the owner of Rossi's restaurant come out and try and show us where elk might be. Two Department of Water and Power (DWP) employees gave us a few hints. Even Department of Fish and Game (DFG) commented to where they could be but none were to be found.

Being diehards, we tried every day. It's kind of hard to take when you're in the coffee shop and you hear guys talking about the dummies wasting their time elk hunting when there are no cows on the east side of Highway 395.

What's worse, is that we found out that there haven't been any cows taken in the Tinnemaha herd for three previous hunts because the elk stay on the west side of Highway 395. If this is true, DFG has printed hunter success rates that are totally not true.

Saturday, Nov 24 the game warden stopped us in the gas station in Big Pine, checked my partner's tag, asked about the elk we had seen taken. I commented about the way the DFG handles this elk hunt. He said DFG officials were aware of the problem and that a change was in the works,

The cost of the elk tag was $277 for a resident. This is the highest resident tag in all the United States. Nevada resident tag was $100 and that is for an area where there are elk to hunt.

I think the only thing in the works by DFG is to issue more tags next year. There is always going to be someone to apply once, but not too many people like to be taken for a fool twice on the same scam.

There is no reason why elk could not be hunted on the west side of Highway 395. One DWP person said it was for safety we couldn't hunt there. I don't think so. I hunted quail and dove there in year 2001. Deer hunting is allowed west of Highway 395 here. That kind of "blows" the safety theory. The biologist at the orientation said the herd needed to be thinned out by at least 30 head.

So if they do thin this herd out, it will probably, be done by a few select people and the hunting area will be adjusted to suit the lucky ones.

Unless the present elk hunting rules are changed there will be more and more unhappy elk hunters, but the real losers will be all the merchants and residents along Highway 395. My partner and I had a trailer we camped in at a "no fee" area. Places we spent money  include Ranch House Cafe and Texaco, PJ'S Coffee Shop, Country Kitchen, Mobil, Rossi's, Napa Auto, Shell, K-Mart, Mojave Red Brewery, Joseph's Bi-Rite, Bishop Country Club, Schat's, Kava Coffee House, Carroll's Market, Rockin' Rhino, These are just some of the places we spent our money. These are the real losers, the merchants and the residents of the area. We spent about $950 and I think that would be on the low side for all hunters.

       When we go hunting or fishing we don't expect to get game or fish every time, but we would like a chance.

        The people in the area we were at didnt seem to like this situation either. I know the two of us will not participate in this drawing until we see improvement in the elk hunt rules.

Timothy L. Whitesell

Sun Valley

 

[wavesfr]

Funny this comes up now. Yesterday I talked to john fischer the head of the elk department. FINALLY after a week of trying everyday. He (DID) tell Me it was a waist of time to apply for this hunt. Being that all the elk are on the other side of 395. That they don't know what to do about this either. Said they will just get over fences if they put them up. But they are trying to figure something out? He said after opening day that ALL elk travel to that side of the road. Don't try to get anything done through sacramento either unless you like getting mad. You can call them & they will still tell you that the fhl hunt is going to be a redraw. Even though there is no hunt code & john fischer his self told Me the guys that drew last year (ARE) getting there tags this year. So good luck wavesfr

 

[Bishop]

I put in for that hunt 2 years ago because it had the most tags and highest success rate 80-100%.  My son and I both got picked (party tag) that year.  During our period there were 10 antlerless tags and 4 bull tags given out.  We only hunted the first weekend, but we both filled our tags, and that weekend at least 6 others filled tags, including 3 bulls. So, I personally know of 8 of the 14 tags being filled.  Don't know if any others were flled after the first weekend.  There was a big herd of elk on the west side of 395, but a equally large group 60-80 on the east side.  
I think the biggest advantage we had was the fact that we hunted Period 1.  They did tell us at the orientation that the elk will get spooky and spread out after they get hunted a bit.  
I do agree that $277.00 is too much for a resident tag, but I was glad to pay it because it is so rare to get one in Calif.

 

[EricW]

Well, I know for a fact that the published success odds mean nothing. A buddy of mine got the Sheephole ram hunt last year, and did not harvest after weeks of hard hunting. He was the only hunter, so the success should be 0%, yet are listed as 100%. This is a really tough hunt, yet lots of suckers will see the 100% success listed, think the hunt is not that bad, and put it down for their once in a lifetime dream sheep hunt. Another buddy of mine got your cow hunt about five years ago, and had the same problem. The only guys to harvest were those who ambushed them the first 15 minutes of the hunt. There was nothing left after that to hunt. They have had a problem with that hunt longer than you think.

(Edited by EricW at 6:49 am on May 18, 2002)

 

[huntducks]

Wish this would have been up monday when I mailed in, I have been putting in for #426(bull) for years and this year mailed in for #431 (cow) which is period 2 :confused-yellow:

 

[shovelerslayer]

Hunt Ducks,

Don't sweat it, if you draw and are willing to hunt with some effort you'll get the elk.  Two years ago a good friend drew the second period antlerless there.  I went down with him and we spent four days hunting (two weekends) for him to tag out.   We saw elk every day, and saw folks harvest two other elk.  After we got his elk butchered we stopped at a coffee shop and listened to another "hunter" complain that he had been ripped off because there were no elk in this area....

 

[rlwright]

I'm not an elk hunter yet, but by the sound of the situation I probably missing something. Why doesn't anyone just herd the animals to the legal side of the highway?

 

[MAC]

herding is not a possibility, unless you would like to be herded up yourself right after you are done by the game wardens.

 

[Hogskin]

Well if the DFG knows it's a problem, why don't they herd the dang elk to the other side of the highway??  I swear, the level of competence in most government workers is staggeringly low.

Been trying to draw one of those tags for nearly 20 years.  I'll probably finally draw one and they'll all be on the wrong side.  

Regards,
Paul

 

[spectr17]

I met one of the DFG wardens mentioned in this letter, he was watching the herd near Bishop last weekend and pulled up next to me as soon as I stopped near the Black Rock Hatchery. He told a different story than the guy in the letter and it backs up what several others have posted here already.

The elk get pretty spooked early on and you'd better make the first shot count. After that it's a chase game after some twitchy elk. The earlier hunts have better odds than the later hunts due to the pressure. The elk are there you just have to do some humping to find them, it is not a slam dunk hunt. Some of the elk do bail over to the west side of the highway.

The warden said his boss had already tagged a guy for harassing the elk and they were trying to keep the looky loos from bothering the elk and elk bow hunters when I was there. The elk bow season opened Saturday 8/10/02  for 9 days. He said they had caught guys out in the fields with antlers. He also mentioned that the west side of the highway would not be an option to hunters.

For those of you who want to hunt the elk with a bow like me, it was pretty hot, near 92 that day. The elk were bugling and chasing already. The terrain is low sage with mixed alfalfa fields and some patches of trees and treelines. There are also cattle all over that can blow a stalk.

I posted some pics of the elk, there under the thread with the Lone Pine Elk Pics title.

 

[hronk]

"They caught people out in the fields with antlers"  Please explain that one for me.  Were the wearing them???  Trying to get their own cow??  I hope that they weren't trying to attract a bow hunter!....hronk

 

[spectr17]

hronk,

When he mentioned "caught wiith antlers" it didn't dawn on me until after he left to ask if they were sheds, the guy was trying to rattle in elk or what. I'm guessing sheds but you never know, I've seen guys walking around with a buck decoy durig rifle season in Missouri.

The warden was grilling me pretty good about what I was doing there and where I had been until I name dropped your name and card. I couldn't remember your last name and he thought I was giving him the "Yeah, my friend Bob" story. He knew you and eased off a bit. Late 30, early 40s. dark hair, maybe 6', medium build, wore sunglasses with a translucent purple frame. Wurthing maybe for last name? I looked at his name tag but it's a blur now. He knew you from honker hunting.