What would you do?

[HOGHUNTER714]

This happended to a co-worker of mine and I just wanted to see what you guys would do if placed in this situation.

Your hunting lawfully on a small piece of property. The property is approximately 700 acres. The neighboors ranch pretty much surrounds the piece of property, except for the southwest corner where you access the property from the main road. Your told from the owner of the property that his neighboor is AGAINST HUNTING & HUNTERS. Your glassing a ridge and you spot a decent size sow approximately 75 to 100 yards out in some shrub oak. You take your shot and its a good shot. The hog takes off so you think you made a lung shot. The hog runs approximately 50 yards uphill towards the fence and out of sight. You get over to where you last saw the hog and you see the hog dead on the other side of the fence within rock throwin distance. All that is going through your head is what the owner of the property told you about his neighboor. You call the owner and he says he will try to call his neighboor and get permission to recover your game. The owner calls you back and says that he spoke to his neighboor and he REFUSED to give you permission to recover your game....Tough call, do u recover your game and risk arrest for trespassing? Or do you leave this animal that you have the moral/ethical responsiblty to recover?

 

[Cda55]

You contact DFG or the local sherriff and have them give you a hand but don't go on his ground without permission.

 

[Shot]

Cda55 summed it all up

 

[birdhunter88]

What do the state laws say about recovering down game there ?

Here in Iowa if the same situation were to happen. We have laws that maintain the hunter the right to track and recover his game. "As long as you do it without a firearm." You do not have to ask permission and if another person such as a landowner were to try to stop you or hinder your recovery. They would be arrested for doing just that. I am curious if California happens to have any similiar law. If not you should push for one.

 

[Mnfshrman]

I'm with cdaa, contact the dfg or sheriff and have them escort.

 

[huntducks]

Simple you go find another pig this time you shoot him in the head or neck no running no moving just drop and flop.

The DFG or local law have no right either to go onto this man's property to escort you, now if local warden knows this anti-hunters I might make a call to warden asking help if not I would have went and asked the anti F2F.

learn from your loss quit shooting pigs in the lungs unless you got room to chase them.

I'll tell you about a friend of mine who got a trespassing ticket 2 years ago he cut across the corner of PP about 200 yards while walking in to hunt (archery deer) it cost him all his gear bow back pack binos and his daughter gear she was hunting too you name it all consifacted everything he was carrying, + $1000 fine, 3 probation, if he so much as gets a ticket he could lose his hunting rights for 5 years and the DA plea bargined this deal out of court with him, as his buddy that was with him already went to trial and lost the judge thru the book at him.

 

[DKScott]

Huntducks, that sounds pretty extreme if all they were doing was taking a brief shortcut. Simple tresspass is not generally that big a deal. How did it escalate to that? Was the case prosecuted as something else? I would have expected that at the beginning of the encounter they would merely have been told to leave immediately - which they would be obligated to do.

Back to the point, CA like most every other state has "wanton waste of game" laws. At least some other states also have right-to-retrieve laws or court rulings. It seems that in the given situation, the hunter is put in a no-win situation of committing a crime whichever way he chooses. I agree that its best to get a game warden to intervene - at least if you think you'll be observed (wink). They have the authority to enter and I can't see a warden allowing the animal to go to waste. It seems like there should be some provision in the law in CA. Maybe a pig is not a big deal, but what if the animal had been an elk or a bighorn?

Any attorneys want to weigh in?

 

[huntallday]

I would of just went and grabbed the pig dragged it back to legal property and tagged it and headed on home.

 

[GUNNER5569]

hunt duck it sounds like your freind was cited for hunter tresspass it is a mistamener and carries and heavier fine up to 3000.00 and or one year in jail plus the loss of your weapons and gear thats what we where charged with at stockdale mt ours was 2500.00 1 day in jail and 3 years probation but we didnt loss our guns luckly i presonaly would have left my rifle and crawled over and drug it back thats my

but it would have costed him if he had got caught

 

[Bruz]

A rock throws distance? Leave my equiptment and jump the fence, be back over before anyone could see me...may not be the "legal" answer but it is the ethical answer I feel.

 

[Hunter29]

Carry a lariat!! Rope the bastard if he is on the other side of the fence and drag it back to you! Just a thought lol

 

[DKScott]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

hunt duck it sounds like your freind was cited for hunter tresspass it is a mistamener and carries and heavier fine up to 3000.00 and or one year in jail plus the loss of your weapons[/b]

Isn't that essentially the same as being cited for poaching? Is the difference merely the possession of game?

 

[VHRAM]

overhearing a conversation by the ranch owner and game warden at a ranch I hunt on near king city anyone without permisson to hunt on his property is poaching

 

[F350]

Personally,
I would have left my weapon and other gear on my side of the fence with the exception of my rope, gone over and tied an end to the hog, and dragged him back.

If confronted by the land owner and asked to leave, I would immediately comply with their request to leave.

In most cases an unarmed "trespasser" won't be cited or charged with trespassing unless they refuse a lawful order to leave a persons property. I've dealt with similar situations in the past and the most that usually happens is that the trespasser is issued a warning.

I feel I have a moral obligation to recover the game and if the other land owner and/or Peace Officer can see that your not there hunting as you have no equipmnt with you, the reasonable response would be to let you continue and ask you not to return.

I say, check with DFG before such situations could arise and know your legal rights before hand.

Just My

"Nuff said"

 

[m57jager]

Yeah,

Cda is right legally, but if it was alright w/ the ranch owner you knew and out of sight I'd hop over and get it.

The real problem is that you need to stop switching rifles and learn how to shoot ONE. A pig anatomy class wouldn't be bad either, the lungs aren't in the hooves.

 

[huntducks]

It's not wanton waste if you have to trespass to get a animal.

DK Scott i'm sure my friend was charged as gunner5569 said i'm not really sur what the charge was but all he did was cut the corner of PP up above San Dimas Cyn. the Laws is always up there making a issure out of any hunter as the local home owner are a bunch of anti's.

Let me fill you guys in on hunting next to any federal wildlife areas or on a Fed area, you shoot a bird it falls into a closed zone you or your dog better not attempt to retreive it or you will be cited no if and or but's I have many a time asked a Fed warden to retreive a birds for me and 50% of the time they will give you permission or come and get for you, but I have watched as Fed warden will stake out a downed bird and watch for someone trying to get then issue a ticket.

Throw this moral & ethical thing out the window TRESPASSING is TRESPASSING simple as that you walk away if you don't have permission.

 

[superduty]

California like most states if I'm not mistaken have a Fair Chase Law. If you were to have shot an animal that crosses over to an adjacent landowners, by law you have the right to retieve that animal without the landowners permission. This doesn't give you the right to cross a property line and shoot a healthy animal that you couldn't have gotten otherwise. That would be considered Trespassing. Anyways, I feel you are morally obligated to retieve your animal or make the final kill if necessary and retrieve. Personnelly I never would have asked giving the other land owner the option to say no. I would be field dressing my pig with a fresh beer in hand.

 

[hogswildguide]

We have gone through this on many many ocassions. If you are hunting an area that boarders a neighborsthis is going to happen. However, by law you have the right to retreive your game no matter what anyone says but here is the trick. A boundary line is just that and while hunting you must obey the line. However, if a pig comes under the fence and is one foot one your side it is legal no matter what. If the pig turns and runs on the neighbors you have the right to retrieve your animal once and only once a destinguished blood trail is proven before the animal crosses the boundary line. If the blood trail starts ten foot on the neighbors side then you have not proven that you did not poach the animal. So if you had a blood trail then you were good. If you did not have a blood trail then you are out of luck and do not have the right to persue any animal.

 

[DKScott]

That sounds reasonable. The law usually provides a means to do the right thing. Does anybody have the specific Section of the Fish & Game Code that provides for this? It might be nice to have a copy handy just in case.

One question though: What about birds shot legally but landing on private or off-limits property? Is it just T.S. or only OK if we get a warden as an intervenor as Huntducks suggests?

 

[birdhunter88]

I'm sorry guys.... but I went to the California game codes and was lost immediately... I just can't believe that there isn't anything in your codes that allows you to pursue wounded or down game. Here is some copy out of Iowa's game code that deals specifically with Trespass/Obstruction/Retrieval....

Here if you shoot a game animal and it doesn't matter what it is.... "You have the right to pursue that animal (anywhere) it goes." It is not trepassing to go onto private ground in pursuit of wounded or down game. And if a landowner interfers he is breaking the law and will be dealt with in a serious way. If you make no attempt to pursue the wild game then you will be dealt with in a serious way. No matter if the game is on public or private ground. "Just do it unarmed" This they are very serious about. Iowa and its citizians take this very seriously and the retrieval of wounded or downed game is more important than wheather Joe Schmoe doesn't want you on his ground. We say tough do dah's Joe Schmoe.... retrieval of the game is more important and if you interfer with the retrieval of such game, You will pay the price !



“Trespass” means entering property without the express permission of the owner, lessee or person in lawful possession, with the intent to commit a public offense; to use, remove there-from, alter, damage, harass, or place anything animate or inanimate, or to hunt, fish or trap on the property. This paragraph does not prohibit the unarmed pursuit of game or fur-bearing animals lawfully injured or killed which come to rest on or escape to the property of another. The term trespass does not mean entering the right-of-way of a public road or highway. Railroad right-of-ways are considered private property.


Obstruction of Hunting or Trapping. No one may intentionally obstruct the participation of another in the lawful activity of hunting, fishing or trapping, including but not limited to:

A) intentionally placing oneself in a location where human presence may affect the behavior of a fur-bearing animal, game bird or fish or the feasibilty of killing or taking a furbearing animal, game bird or fish with the intent of obstructing or harassing another person who is lawfully hunting, fishing or trapping.
B) intentionally creating a visual, aural, olfactory or physical stimulus for the purpose of effecting the behavior of a fur-bearing animal, game bird or fish with the intent of obstructing or harass-ing another person who is lawfully hunting, fishing or trapping.
C) intentionally affecting the trapping condition or altering the placement of personal property used for the purpose of taking furbearing animals, birds or fish
with the intent of obstructing or harass-ing another person who is lawfully hunting, fishing or trapping. A person shall not interfere with the lawful hunting, fishing or trapping activities of another person where hunting, fishing or trapping is authorized by a custodian of public property or an owner or lessee of private property. This rule does not prohibit a landowner, tenant or an employee of the landowner or tenant from performing normal agricul-tural operations or a law enforcement officer from performing offical duties.


Retrieval and Waste of Game While taking or attempting to take game or furbearing animals, you cannot abandon the injured animal without making a reasonable effort to retrieve it from the field. You cannot leave a usable portion of the game or furbearing animal in the field. “Usable portion” in this instance means the following: 1) for game, that part of an animal that is
customarily processed for consumption; and 2) for furbearing animals, the fur or
hide of the animal.